No advance in PocketPC's?

[phx]

Last year i checked to buy a pocketpc, hp4700 and dell axim50 was around. now that i check again. still the same models , new OS but very little advance in hardware. Are these type of devices are at the end of the road under heavy attacks from cellphones and mp3 players?

[BremenCulhaven]

Last year i checked to buy a pocketpc, hp4700 and dell axim50 was around. now that i check again. still the same models , new OS but very little advance in hardware. Are these type of devices are at the end of the road under heavy attacks from cellphones and mp3 players?


I see the end of the road being a cell phone, pocket pc, with mp3 player and video play back abilities... Why get a video ipod a pda and have a cell phone. In the end I see a multitech cell phone as the answer...just one device to carry.

[phx]

i agree with that. paying all three devices (+ a digicam) costs more than a notebook. and you just cant carry all of these.
Only problem i see is the size. i want an at least 4' screen. and thats too big for a cellphone.

[ua549]

Last year I purchased a Motorola V635 cell phone. It has a few applications, plays MP3's, has a 1.3 megapixel camera and more than 525MB memory. Not only that, I can make phone calls, send/receive email, browse the web and tether it to my notebook computer with Bluetooth or USB for worldwide internet access at ~200kbps for a flat rate of < $25 per month (no roaming). Why would I want a PocketPC? PocketPC's are a dead product.

[phx]

Why would I want a PocketPC? PocketPC's are a dead product.
Maybe its 4' screen being the only reason?
or maybe pocketpc's have faster cpu's? tough i havent seen much application which are cpu dependant.
I also keep an eye on Nokia's new 770 tablet. it looks like a nice gadget

[ua549]

The 2" screen is quite easy to use because it is very sharp. When tethered to my noteook, the notebook has all the functionality of the phone plus the notebook functionality - the best of both worlds.

On the other hand you could simply get a cellphone PC Card for a noteook and have the same capabilities, but the battery wouldn't go for a week between charges.

Have you looked at a blackberry phone? They have a bigger screen and an alphanumeric keyboard.

[Johnmcl7]

I think the decline of PDAs has a lot to do with the large number of smartphones on the go, I changed over to UIQ a couple of years ago from my dedicated PDA and was fairly happy with it.

Another reason I would say is that Pocket PC OS is a joke, it's absolutely pathetic - my three year old Zaurus' OS was lightyears ahead. Despite packing a 612Mhz processor, my X50V is sluggish and often needs resetting, by default pocketpc2003 has no battery meter on the display nor a proper task manager. It's a shame because the X50V hardware is superb, it has a beautiful VGA screen, BT, wi-fi, 612Mhz processor, SD and CF slots etc- the closest phone is the HTC Universal, which is nearly double the weight, slower and no CF.

John

[PCJ]

The best PDA ever was the Palm Tungsten C.

It was one of the first to have WiFi. It was the first to have a full keyboard. It ran an OS that didn't suck. It was small. It had enough power... I loved that thing. I still have it somewhere...

[kpxgq]

i used to be a hardcore PocketPC junkie... went from Palm 3 to Palm 5 => Toshiba e355 => Dell Axim X3i = > Dell Axim X30 => HP Ipaq 4500 => Asus 720w

but the same problem exists... lack of quality software plus the good ones are at a price where its hard to justify one over a cheap laptop.

i have recently switched over to the Symbian OS camp with the Nokia 3250. I have a feeling smartphones are going to slowly take over PocketPC/Palms. Phones like the JasJar have all the functionality of a PocketPC with the added benefits of a phone and camera

[Johnmcl7]

The Jasjar is huge though., as I said it's double the weight of the X50V but yet slower and no CF. Plus as with most HTC devices, the camera is pretty much useless, it doesn't compare to the fairly decent cameras on the SE and Nokias.

John

[Soul Assassin]

I really hate smartphones/blackberries myself. They are way too bulky and take the worst of both worlds -- too big for a phone, too small for a PDA. Plus since it's your phone, you have to take it with you everywhere, whereas a PPC you can leave in the car if you're going out to a club or something, since you really don't need it.

Give me my iPaq HX2795 & Razr anyday over a bulky smartphone. And let's not even get started on cell phone cameras. If you use one instead of a proper digital camera, you obviously don't care about taking pictures in the first place.

I really don't see why everyone wants consolidation. You're giving up the advantages of the platforms. PPCs w/ 2" screens are useless, and phones with 4" screens are bulky and weird to stick up to your face. You're constantly wiping off the screen, and god forbid you crack the screen.

[Johnmcl7]

Although phone cameras can't replace a decent digital camera, some of the new ones are surprisingly good, especially on Sonyericssons - I've been caught out a few times without a camera on me and my phone has given me an acceptable result.

John

[Soul Assassin]

It ran an OS that didn't suck.

You never actually turned it on, did you? The PalmOS is 100000% garbage.

Actually, I take that back, it's gotten better since it's tried to become more like a PPC. Now it's only 5000% garbage.

[phx]

I really hate smartphones/blackberries myself. They are way too bulky and take the worst of both worlds -- too big for a phone, too small for a PDA.
I tend to think that way , since its going to be a hand computer , it should have a bigger screen. i checked the Nokia 3250 i dont see how a usefull software will work on that small screen.

[sna]

why buying a PDA? at all? and talking about poor windows system ont PDA???
while now u can get FULL functioning Windows XP machine WITH 20G harddisk and ulv INTEL 1Ghz, 512-1G ram, 800x600 LCD inside a case which is SAME SIZE OF PDA???
with WIFI too

and it is a standard PC... put linux if u want too ;)

PDA is DEAD

Micro PC is coming :)

and this is 2004 news :) in JAPAN :(

here u go :

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/05/10/sony_u70_1.jpg

link :
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/12/03/review_sony_vaio_u70/

I remembered this now and looking for 2006 products in japan :)

be back soon

edit : did i mention it is real TABLET PC??? with windows tablet edition?

[sna]

umm If u can read JApanese :

edit : Offecial SITE in JAPANESE :

http://www.vaio.sony.co.jp/Products/VGN-U70/

[sna]

here are some nice reviews :

trustedreviews : http://www.trustedreviews.com/article.aspx?art=876

PCMAG : http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1754438,00.asp

and just to see the size of it in hands
http://www.vaio.sony.co.jp/Products/VGN-U70/Images/U_lead_top.jpg

[sna]

complete specs :

CPU: 1Ghz INTEL 512 cahche ULV 400 FSB
chipset: Intel 855GM with onboard intel extreme graphics (real 3D DX8)
Memory: 512MB DDR 266
LCD : TFT-SVGA 800x600 !!!!!!!!! 5 inch and Bright one
External VGA : 1600×1200、1280×1024、1280×768、1024×768、800×600
harddisk : 20GB （Ultra ATA/100）
WIFI : IEEE 802.11b/g
I/O : 100/10 , Firewire i - link, USB2
dimensions 165mm×19.5mm×113mm

now after this u consider PDA??? this is released 2004
I wonder whats coming now.. a dual core one ulv ??? :)
PDA are History now
I bet new even lower sized is coming

[ua549]

It doesn't look very practical for other than off-line gaming.
No keyboard.
No phone=no communications (most places).

[sna]

It doesn't look very practical for other than off-line gaming.
No keyboard.
No phone=no communications (most places).

it has standard type II notebook slot (pcmci)
u add the commuication device u need

plus wifi roaming??
and most PDA even DEll Axim, ASUS,looX have no keyboard..

anyway this is 2004 stuff
PDA is DEAD
now it is REAL PC callit MPC (micro pc) no PDA at all

[sna]

man this is a real pc

a Movie player killer too at 800x600 with FULL PC capabilities

a full DX8 PDA sized too

and there is the optional portaable keybaord u can carry around , u can use any wirless pocket keyboad if u wish

and the docking station is very nice too

[ua549]

it has standard type II notebook slot (pcmci)
u add the commuication device u need

plus wifi roaming??
and most PDA even DEll Axim, ASUS,looX have no keyboard..

anyway this is 2004 stuff
PDA is DEAD
now it is REAL PC callit MPC (micro pc) no PDA at all
WiFi roaming is a joke compared to cellular roaming.
Unfortunately, when one uses a cellular PC Card the price for data triples.
The Blackberry and similar units have a complete keyboard.

[sna]

WiFi roaming is a joke compared to cellular roaming.
Unfortunately, when one uses a cellular PC Card the price for data triples.
The Blackberry and similar units have a complete keyboard.

True ...

but anyway the PDA is dead, and when sony comes out with the next U90 , I think it will include missing things here remember this tiny thing is an 2004 product. and if they managed to put ULV P-M 1G , DDr ram , i855 chipset and MOST IMPORTANT 800x600 LCD in this tiny size, then expect to see some REAL tiny PC , 2004 we didnt have .8 inch harddisk inside this one is 1.5 inch one ;)
and new yonah ULV are coming :)
...

the thing is , why researching PDA system (Crap) while u can use FULL win XP now?? it is possible

[freedon]

I don't care for my cellphone, so I just bought the cheapest one there is $40ish.

I admit, the phone does kinda suck and the provider sucks more (there are only 3 and this one is the biggest one in Mexico...)

Bought a used a Dell Axim, give me a style pen over any 12-16 button cellphone any day.

Considering the price I payed for my cell phone and pda, I can do a lot more with my pda then with my cellphone.

Now, if I really needed cellphone with an OS, then my next choice would be a Palm Treo (smarphone)

Now something I hate about the cellphone gimmick, low life cycle. I don't know about you guys, but most of the people I know change cellphone AT LEAST 2 times per year.

[PriMaTe]

I don't care for my cellphone, so I just bought the cheapest one there is $40ish.

I admit, the phone does kinda suck and the provider sucks more (there are only 3 and this one is the biggest one in Mexico...)

Bought a used a Dell Axim, give me a style pen over any 12-16 button cellphone any day.

Considering the price I payed for my cell phone and pda, I can do a lot more with my pda then with my cellphone.

Now, if I really needed cellphone with an OS, then my next choice would be a Palm Treo (smarphone)

Now something I hate about the cellphone gimmick, low life cycle. I don't know about you guys, but most of the people I know change cellphone AT LEAST 2 times per year.

I don't think people change cell phones for more features too often, people usually do it because they want to have the newest phones.

Don't blackberry's and pdas in cell phones like that make regular pdas useless? You can get your email, set reminders, the only thing that a pda can do over a blackberry is type documents and maybe go on the internet? I have a feeling I overlooked something.

What do you guys use pdas for and what features do you need?

[ua549]

I change cell phones about once every 5 or 6 years per line. I really don't think there can be much in the way of new features in cell phones, only small incremental improvements. IMO there has not been a new feature in the past year and a half. The last significant new feature was streaming TV/video that came out in the middle of 2004.

[Johnmcl7]

I change my mobile phone every three to four months, there's usually enough improvements to make it worthwhile.

John

[phx]

i used a palm for a while (not for a long time it was a friend's) . it had a anatomy book, and a few basic medical books. i tought its great to have them with you all the time. but searched some software sites, i see that every other software i find is somewhat insufficient. there isnt much high quality medical software (or i didnt see any)
But for this purpose where you do little input , but lots of data to read a keyboard isnt necessary. nor you need a full winxp computer. i think a screen at minimum 4' is a must. it must have a very very fast boot time . so that if you want to check one work in an medical encyclopedia you can turn on , look at it , shutdown.

[ua549]

Have you looked a electronic book readers?

[kent1146]

PDAs, by themselves, are dead nowadays because we are so dependent on connectivity and networking when working with our data. The future of PDA OS'es are in PDA phones. And the two killer apps for PDA phones are email and GPS (although GPS will operate just fine on a regular PDA).

Why would I buy and carry a PDA + Cell Phone, when I can just carry a smart phone that does them both?

[Johnmcl7]

Because the smartphone is potentially bigger than both a cellphone and equivalent PDA put together, yet not as good a the phone or the PDA.

John

[kent1146]

Nobody buys a smartphone just because they want a cell phone, or just because they want a PDA, for the reason that you cite: It's too bulky. What you forget is that people nowadays typically buy a smartphone to get email on the go. And that is a function that can only be achieved when you combine PDA + Cell Phone.

[Johnmcl7]

PDAs still pack a lot of options not available on phones or smartphones - if I use my GPS on a smartphone, I lose storage capabilities but on my X50V I can still use the vacant CF slot for large storage plus the high resolution screen and beefy processor make for a much better sat nav experience. It will be good when HTC can get the size of the Universal (XDA Exec, Imate Jasjar, SPV M5000 etc) down to current standalone PDA size/weight.

John

[ua549]

Lots have phones have as much storage as a PDA. Even my small Motorola V635 has over 1GB of usable storage for any knid of files - email, mp3, video, photos, games, etc.

[ImaNihilist]

All major cell phone manufacturers are currently working on phones with 2GB, 4GB, and 8GB HDDs. Some are supposed to be out by the end of the year.

[Soul Assassin]

It's only January, so the end of the year might as well be next year. Either way, it's a lifetime in the world of technology.

John: The reason the x50v seems slow from time to time has more to do with the VGA screen than the processor/OS. I have the iPaq 2795 which has the same processor and it doesn't slow down very often. Reviews online seem to back this up. PPCs aren't designed for VGA acceleration, so despite the fact that your "video card" is better than mine, it's not being taken advantage of.

Windows Mobile 5.0 is the biggest step I've seen in PPC development for a long time. You finally don't lose all your friggin data when the battery dies. The trade-off is speed, which should get better as higher speed EEPROM chips become available.

I for one am not a fan of having everything in one unit. It's just more things to be offline when the unit breaks. Get a PDA/Cell/mp3 unit and you can't do any of those things when the screen breaks, as it probably will since everyone I've ever known with a smartphone has cracked the screen at least once.

Then again I may be the only person around who still runs separate router/access point instead of buying one of the magical combo units. I'd wager that no matter where you look, separate components are still better than combination units, be it stereos, networking equipment, pdas/cell phones, etc.

[rhettro]

That's one aspect of convergence that concerns me on the whole MP3/Phone/PDA issue. Everything improves, and having an all-in-one device makes it that much more expensive when you want to upgrade or if it breaks.

[PCJ]

kp, how is that 3250 treating you? I've been having an eye on it, since it has a similar size as my 6230i, but is much more capable. How is the OS? S60 has been a mixed bag for me so far. Depending on the phone, performance has been anywhere from decent to godawful. Where does the 3250 fit in.

Also, is the music player better? Left -> 2 -> up/down is alright for browsing my music, but I'd rather have something better.

Since it doesn't use a nokia port, I would assume the radio is builtin?

Finally, most important, is the twisting thingy actually worth anything, or is it just another gimmick?

[phx]

so i guess buying a slightly cheaper PDA with 640x480 display is better.Faster cpus doesnt make much difference since there arent many software that will make use of it.no need to buy a hp4700. right?

[Johnmcl7]

Lots have phones have as much storage as a PDA. Even my small Motorola V635 has over 1GB of usable storage for any knid of files - email, mp3, video, photos, games, etc.

That's fairly pathetic compared to a PDA, which can offer up to 30GB storage.

John

[ua549]

It is a tiny phone that uses microSD. There are phones that can use a hard drive with PDA equivilent capacity.

[ImaNihilist]

The reality is that the PDA, DAP, and cell phone are merging.

What I'd really like to see is another Apple MessagePad. The Apple MessagePad 2000 was awesome.

[freedon]

The reality is that the PDA, DAP, and cell phone are merging.

What I'd really like to see is another Apple MessagePad. The Apple MessagePad 2000 was awesome.


Never heard of it

[vertices]

Get a Treo 700W from Verizon running Windows Mobile 5.0. I'm honestly blown away by it. I've got mine syncing directly with our Exchange server over the air to give me my entire mailbox. I'm talking contacts, calendars, Inbox, all mail folders, my task list, sent items, junk mail. Everything completely synced with Exchange. And this is directly to Exchange, no desktop software required. You also don't need to buy an expensive server like BlackBerry Enterprise Server. It works fantastic with Exhcange 2003 SP2.

And in a about a month or so when the "Messaging and Security Feature Pack" is released, you'll be able to issue a remote wipe command, or enforce security policies on the phone. Right from Exchange.

The voice command works flawlessly. I've got instant access to anyone in my outlook contacts in realtime by just saying "Call so and so, mobile, or work" with no voice training.

Having IE, Pocket word and Excel, and other apps is awesome. I've only got to carry 1 device and it's everything for me. Phone, email, web browser, everything. I get about 90kbps nationwide and about 500kbps in big cities.

I honestly don't have 1 bad thing to say about this phone. I'm moving all the guys in my company over to them. Everyone can't wait to get one as I'm the only with 1 so far.

Check it out.....BTW did I say it F'in rocked?:D:D:D


You can install certs to it. I installed the certs for our servers on it so I can encrypt all of the Outlook Mobile Access and ActiveSync traffic. Hell you can VPN from it. It's even got a Terminal Services client, it's awesome.

[Soul Assassin]

I sync with my 2795 via Wifi. My boss has an HP hw6515 on Cingular and he syncs with Exchange OTA and it works like a champ. So no matter how you cut it, PPCs are the bomb.

I don't mind not being able to sync continuously in order to have a minimum size cell phone. In today's world hotspots are common enough that I can sync in enough places without issue. I would say that within 4 years the entire US (or at least the urban areas) will be covered in Wifi so needing a cellular connection will be pointless.

[Johnmcl7]

Annoyingly, they've removed wi-fi syncing in the newer versions of Activesync which you have to use for Wm 5.0 devices.

I've just picked up an HTC Wizard and Tornado (my variant has no wi-fi) - the keyboard on the Wizard is very nice and WM 5.0 seems surprisingly responsive, I find web browsing much better than on the X50V. Missing the 640x480 screen and 624Mhz processor but given the size and weight that's understandable. Only thing is the wi-fi slaughters the battery, has to be used very sparingly when you're away from the mains although USB charging is nice, especially since it uses a standard mini usb cable.

John

[Johnmcl7]

It is a tiny phone that uses microSD. There are phones that can use a hard drive with PDA equivilent capacity.

Which phones have 30GB onboard storage?

John

[LaValva]

Check out the XV6700 from Verizon (Also the PPC-6700 from Sprint)

http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/store/controller?item=phoneFirst&action=viewPhoneDetail&selectedPhoneId=2200

Uses EVDO where available for high-speed broadband, 1X everywhere else cellular service is available.

Direct syncing to Exchange server, and once the update is released for the device, push e-mail will be unabled (When using Exchange 2003)

It's not a perfect phone/PDA, but it's about as close as there is right now.

[rhettro]

I used to use my Pocket PC to syncronize with Outlook, view Excel Spreadsheets and play MP3's. But my new office doesn't allow us to install our own software, so I can't link up to Outlook. I hardly use it anymore. I do like the ability to browse the internet were Wifi is located and the touch screen is a nice feature.