WIN98SE Puzzle: Windows Protection Error, Corrupt setupx.dll?

OK, I ran SCANDISK /all on all three of my hard drive partitions and no errors were found. I have two drives, on of which is partitioned.)

Here are some answers to the questions posted.

Do you have both HDDs on the Same IDE Channel? ---> I'm not sure. What's the best way to determine this?

Both Optical drives on the other ? ---> Not sure.
any ZIP drives? No ZIP drives.

Are you SURE you didn't mess up (leave previously changed settings) while in MSCONFIG -- IOW, it's back to "NORMAL" Startup? ---> That's a good question. I guess I'm not sure. I playing around with that for a while. How can I tell what my "normal" setting was?

Using a NIC or Dialup? ---> I connect to the internet via ethernet cable to a DSL modem. I'll try to boot to "Safe Mode with Networking".

Are you using User Profiles? ---> No

I'll start trying some of the other suggested steps.

Bob

Quick Update: I just checked the size of the new setupx.dll file residing in C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM and it is indeed 718KB, as you mentioned. So that looks good.

What version of IE is installed? Internet Explorer Version 6.0.02800.1106

---> I'll be offline for a couple of hours....

Bob

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Originally Posted by BobF

OK, I ran SCANDISK /all on all three of my hard drive partitions and no errors were found. I have two drives, on of which is partitioned.)

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...good - ok

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Do you have both HDDs on the Same IDE Channel? ---> I'm not sure. What's the best way to determine this?
Both Optical drives on the other ? ---> Not sure.

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2 devices on the SAME 'Cable' = SAME IDE 'Channel'

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any ZIP drives? No ZIP drives.

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..good

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Are you SURE you didn't mess up (leave previously changed settings) while in MSCONFIG -- IOW, it's back to "NORMAL" Startup? ---> That's a good question. I guess I'm not sure. I playing around with that for a while. How can I tell what my "normal" setting was?

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just go LOOK at it (MSCONFIG) - and select "NORMAL Startup" on the General Tab --

...BUT, i also asked you disable most under the "Startup Tab" (try each way) - Normal startup will RE-enable everything that's "Unticked" undr ALL tabs...so if 'items' are Deselected under Startup tab, or any other tab, you'll notice "Selective Startup" is selected in the General Tab

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Using a NIC or Dialup? ---> I connect to the internet via ethernet cable to a DSL modem. I'll try to boot to "Safe Mode with Networking".

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yep - that's a NIC (Network Interface Card), though DSL isn't necessarily "Direct Connection" (Always On) as Cable Internet is - since it (DSL) uses a Diff protocol (PPPoE)

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Are you using User Profiles? ---> No

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good - less hassle

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I'll start trying some of the other suggested steps.
Bob

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cool -- but do you ususally NEED to enter a PASSWORD at bootup ?

Did you say that you could boot into Safe Mode? This makes me think it could be hardware or driver trouble with a peripheral. Maybe something like a modem, or a scanner? I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the OS must be intact since it boots into Safe Mode okay.

rich

2 devices on the SAME 'Cable' = SAME IDE 'Channel'--> I see. Yes, both hard drives are on one cable and both CD drives are on one cable.


Just go LOOK at it (MSCONFIG) - and select "NORMAL Startup" on the General Tab --

...BUT, i also asked you disable most under the "Startup Tab" (try each way) - Normal startup will RE-enable everything that's "Unticked" undr ALL tabs...so if 'items' are Deselected under Startup tab, or any other tab, you'll notice "Selective Startup" is selected in the General Tab --> Thanks, I'll try that.


yep - that's a NIC (Network Interface Card), though DSL isn't necessarily "Direct Connection" (Always On) as Cable Internet is - since it (DSL) uses a Diff protocol (PPPoE)---I did try Safe Mode with Network but I couldn't seem to go online with IE. So perhaps that's a DSL thing.

But do you ususally NEED to enter a PASSWORD at bootup? ---> No. No Passwords at bootup

Thanks for your help. The modem is PCI card-based but I still have a telephone line hooked up to it. I suppose I could just pull that card anyway since I'm on DSL now. I do have a printer hooked up so I'll check the connections and I'll also try disconnecting it altogether.

Bob

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Originally Posted by TedBellLover

Did you say that you could boot into Safe Mode? This makes me think it could be hardware or driver trouble with a peripheral. Maybe something like a modem, or a scanner? I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the OS must be intact since it boots into Safe Mode okay.

rich

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I just reset the startup config to "Normal" through msconfig. I still get the Windows protection error.

Bob

2. Boot into Safe Mode and look in Device Mangler for any '!' or '?' (red or yellow) next to any devices

Yes, I just tried this. I do have a yellow question mark under the "Other devices" label. Under that heading there are three sub-items listed with yellow question marks:

PCI Card
PCI Multimedia Audio Device
USB Optical WheelMouse

Are any of those items a concern?

Bob

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Originally Posted by BobF

2. Boot into Safe Mode and look in Device Mangler for any '!' or '?' (red or yellow) next to any devices

Yes, I just tried this. I do have a yellow question mark under the "Other devices" label. Under that heading there are three sub-items listed with yellow question marks:

PCI Card
PCI Multimedia Audio Device
USB Optical WheelMouse

Are any of those items a concern?

Bob

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Yes - ofcourse ;)

PCI Card = either your NIC, Modem or Sound Card, or similar
PCI Multimedia Audio Device SoundCard usually
USB Optical WheelMouse..um little rat :)

In Safe Mode, REMOVE all those devices - WITHOUT rebooting
- only Reboot after last one is removed -- the new Hardware Wizard will appear upon reboot (should) and if it can NOT find drivers for each device -- point it to C:\WINDOWS\inf or C:\WINDOWS\inf\Other

,.. and/or your CD with Drivers - but you'll need to browse to that particular device's folder ..depending
(ex; E:\Win95-98\Audio\Drivers) -- it'll be looking for an INF (.inf) file

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Originally Posted by TedBellLover

Did you say that you could boot into Safe Mode? This makes me think it could be hardware or driver trouble with a peripheral. Maybe something like a modem, or a scanner? I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the OS must be intact since it boots into Safe Mode okay.

rich

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good call - that's what i was thinking, just had to wait a little for the OP to walk through some other steps

OK, I removed all three of those devices using the Device Manager. My first reboot came up in Safe Mode. I then forced a reboot in Normal Mode and I got the Windows Protection Error again. Arg! :)

The Hardware Wizard did not come up.

I'm not sure it matters but I'm not currently running a optical mouse. I'm using an old mechanical one.

And I don't have a PCI-based NIC. Instead I'm using the one built into my K7S5A motherboard.

Any ideas for a next step?

In the meantime, I'll go back through this thread and look for steps that I haven't taken yet.

Thanks again for all of the help,

Bob

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Originally Posted by I4one

Yes - ofcourse ;)

PCI Card = either your NIC, Modem or Sound Card, or similar
PCI Multimedia Audio Device SoundCard usually
USB Optical WheelMouse..um little rat :)

In Safe Mode, REMOVE all those devices - WITHOUT rebooting
- only Reboot after last one is removed -- the new Hardware Wizard will appear upon reboot (should) and if it can NOT find drivers for each device -- point it to C:\WINDOWS\inf or C:\WINDOWS\inf\Other

,.. and/or your CD with Drivers - but you'll need to browse to that particular device's folder ..depending
(ex; E:\Win95-98\Audio\Drivers) -- it'll be looking for an INF (.inf) file


good call - that's what i was thinking, just had to wait a little for the OP to walk through some other steps

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OK, here's another update. No luck with anything yet...

1. For safe keeping -- "Write-Protect" your Win98 Bootup floppy (use the physical lever in the corner to LOCK it)--> Thanks for the tip. My boot flopped was not write protected so I moved the tab.

2. Go to https://europe.f-secure.com/download...se/tools.shtml
and d/l the F-Secure Anti-Virus for DOS
create a Boot floppy and Run it on the system

Since I can't seem to access the internet from my PC I tried to download the file onto a floppy via my Mac, But when I click on the file name to download it I get a "File not found" message. I'm probably missing some simple step with that so I'll return to that later.

4. Boot to a "Command Prompt Only" and;
type in DELTREE C:\WINDOWS\TEMPOR~1\CONTENT.IE5 <enter>
type in DELTREE C:\WINDOWS\TEMP\*.* <enter>
type in DEL C:\WINDOWS\TEMP\*.* <enter>
type in DELTREE C\WINDOWS\LOCALS~1\APPLIC~1\*.* <enter>
---> I entered all of these commands to no effect. On the 3rd command I did get a "No Files Found" so perhaps I deleted those earlier.

I'd love to see your SYSTEM.INI and WIN.INI contents
--> Do a Safe Mode Boot -- Start | Run SYSEDIT
Copy and Paste each files contents here

I can't get online with the PC and I can't figure out an easy way for me to post the contents of those files short of typing everything out on my Mac. Is there some way to save those files to a floppy on the PC via a Safe Mode boot?

Check your C:\WINDOWS\Downloaded Program Files folder for Unwanted ActiveX controls and Delete them---> The only ActiveX file that looked potentially troubling was a Disney "Toontown" file that one of my kids must have loaded. I deleted that.

Start | Run MSCONFIG and choose "Startup" Tab - Disable (untick) ALL except "System Tray" and "Scan Registry" -- you will end up re-enabling whatever you unticked---> I did this and I still get the Windows protection error. Should I go back now and reset everything now?

I think the next thing I'll try is to open up the case and pull and reinstall all of the hardware.

If that doesn't work, would reinstalling Windows be a logical step?

And in the Windows install link posted by Cloned above, it seemed to be for loading Windows 98 SE over Windows 98 First Edition. Can I use the same steps to load 98SE on top of my existing 98SE?

Thanks,

Bob

you 'could' just "Disable in this Hardware Profile" in Device mangler for Each under "Other" -- see if she'll boot....I mean at this point, i would've pulled out all offending hardware and knocked the system down to basic components (Mobo/CPU/HSF + 1HDD + (optional 1CD/DVD), 1PS/2mouse + 1PS2 Keyboard + 1Monitor ...and that's it)

I suspect a Hardware issue/fault - whether or not it's a hardware config issue, i can't say -- there are a few tricks, but you might as well just do a reinstall "On top of" -- Yes, 98/98SE are 'basically' the exact same - the install and maintenance procedures are most certainly the same -- so the article does apply.

MSCONFIG trick;
General Tab --> Untick Config.sys/Autoexec.bat/Startup - so only System.ini and Win.ini are loaded - try Booting

no go - do the reverse - but still leave "Startup" unticked

Thanks for the suggestions.

Yes, knocking the system down to its basic components makes a lot of sense at this point. This has been a lot more difficult than I expected.

Bob

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Originally Posted by I4one

you 'could' just "Disable in this Hardware Profile" in Device mangler for Each under "Other" -- see if she'll boot....I mean at this point, i would've pulled out all offending hardware and knocked the system down to basic components (Mobo/CPU/HSF + 1HDD + (optional 1CD/DVD), 1PS/2mouse + 1PS2 Keyboard + 1Monitor ...and that's it)

I suspect a Hardware issue/fault - whether or not it's a hardware config issue, i can't say -- there are a few tricks, but you might as well just do a reinstall "On top of" -- Yes, 98/98SE are 'basically' the exact same - the install and maintenance procedures are most certainly the same -- so the article does apply.

MSCONFIG trick;
General Tab --> Untick Config.sys/Autoexec.bat/Startup - so only System.ini and Win.ini are loaded - try Booting

no go - do the reverse - but still leave "Startup" unticked

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Here another update with a pile of additional steps that were unsuccessful.

1. I tried the MSCONFIG steps listed above.

2. I vacuumed out dust from inside the case.

3. Since I moved the case to another room, I hooked it up to a new monitor, keyboard and mouse.

4. I pulled and re-seated my AGP GeForce 5700LE video card.

5. I pulled the 5700LE altogether and installed my previous PCI-Based Voodoo Video Card.

6. I removed the PCI-based modem.

7. I removed and re-installed both 256 MB DDR RAM sticks.

8. I tried each RAM stick individually.

9. I removed the PCI Sound Blaster Live sound card

10. I disconnected the cable to my CD Drive.

11. I disconnected the cable to my CD Burner.

12. I disconnected both the drive and the burner at the same time.

13. I disconnected my second hard drive. (The one without Windows System files.)

14. I tightened all the motherboard mounting screws.

All of the above steps were unsuccessful. I still get a Windows protection error when I attempt a Normal boot. And I'm only able to boot in Safe Mode.

At this point I'm considering a re-install of Windows. But I'm not entirely comfortable with that so I'm going to research that a bit before giving it a shot.

Feel free to make any additional suggestions. It occurs to me that I could have built a new computer in the time this has taken me so far. ;-)

Bob

yep, you could've -- or you could've just reinstalled in that time as well ;) ...Atleast, if you reinstall, you'll see if it's a true hardware only issue. On a funny note aside - I recall others long ago having issue with setupx.dll,but for the life of me, i can't recall the exact remedy, nor can i remember if it was 'always' that particular remedy that would work...might be something like a corrupt BIOS even. Hence; Flash the BIOS (but hold off for now)

Here's some info google hits i got;
http://www.easydesksoftware.com/error.htm#Protection

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Windows Protection Errors; Try This Before You Format and Re-load

Here's an option to try before reloading Windows. Boot into safe mode and use RegMedic and the R and R All Hardware. If you do not have RegMedic installed then you will have to delete everything you can under device manager. If there are duplicate entries they can cause protection errors. Then boot into normal mode and run the hardware installation wizard. You won't be able to load very many things until the primary IDE controllers are loaded but once they are you should be able to load all of the device drivers. I've had this work many times.

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http://www.geocities.com/~budallen/w...8_startup.html

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Windows Protection Error
Sometimes, Windows may refuse to boot and gives the message "Windows Protection Error. You need to restart your computer." At this point, you're dead in the water unless you boot from a floppy disk.

One cause in Windows 95 is an interaction between SmartDrive and having a large number of device drivers installed. If you see something about "initializing IOS" in the error message, try this fix: Boot from a floppy, find the file Smartdrv.exe (It's usually in the Windows directory), and rename it to Smartdrv.bad. Now try booting the system from the hard disk. The problem is documented in article Q157924 but doesn't give much information about why the problem occurs.

There is a known problem in Windows 95 that affects AMD K6 processors that run at 350MHz or higher speeds. This will sometimes give a Windows protection error message. See Microsoft's document Q192841 for more information.

A complete set of troubleshooting procedures for other causes can be found in Q149962 - Troubleshooting Windows Protection Errors.

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more MS stuff;
APM (Power Management issues) http://support.microsoft.com/kb/q187612/

(General Protection faults)
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=209321

Suggest, you Plug back in all the hardware you removed In the EXACT same PCI slots you removed them from

Unfortunately, removing Hardware requires a certain detailed method as well, and i have no way of knowing "how" exactly you did that -- but nonetheless, even a bad cable, or Mobo bulging caps can be at fault. For Ex; Steps 10 and 11, removing cables -- did you remove Both the Power Cable AND the Data Cable for each device ? (don't worry bout it now though)

Put MSCONFIG back to Normal Startup and then Reboot and go into Device Mangler

... you definitely have a issue within DM (Device Mangler_ keep booting into it and removing those under "Other" and ANY other Duplicates listed, such as 2 Floppy Controllers - expand ALL branches and Remove those duplicates.

(p.s. - I've gone into the Registry and removed the whole entire HKLM\Enum branch in some repair installs (Upon reboot ALL hardware gets ReDetected and installed) - but this is risky too,...I've been trying to proceed somewhat cautiously.

As far as Me seeing your System.ini, etc files contents - well, we have an issue then (read; too much hassle unfortunately).

Do the Reinstall - you'll be fine...If one of your HDDs has only data on it - leave it Uninstalled (No power, and no Data cable) - this way you can't 'lose' that info anyway...speaking of which, since you have 2 HDDs, and if you have space - Boot into Safe mode and Copy over any important data before reinstall