Physics

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Originally posted by elimc:
I believe that they have an extremely accurate clock in the International Space Station. Strangely enough, it is slower than a clock here on earth. The clocks were both set on earth at exactly the same time.

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That should be expected. As someone noted earlier, time slows down as speed increases. Speeds on earth are not enough to make much difference, but in space it can at least reach measureable amounts. Although probably still small since they are still nowhere near light speed.

another fun fact to remember. As your speed increases, you will experience a distortion of distance.

in other words:
The faster you go the shorter the path you take.

If I traveled past the solar system traveling at 75% of the speed of light then the size of the solar system (relative to me) would only be 25% of its original size.

This is another interesting effect of high speeds. So if you are traveling near the speed of light. you have less distance to pass than a person moving slower.

[email protected]

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Originally posted by elimc:
I believe that they have an extremely accurate clock in the International Space Station. Strangely enough, it is slower than a clock here on earth. The clocks were both set on earth at exactly the same time.

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This could also be in partial effect of the lack in the strength of the earths gravitational pull. Gravity has been proven to have an effect on the way time is percieved as well using cesium clocks. Two clocks were synced and one was placed on top of a water tower while the other one was placed at the bottom of the tower. They left the clocks for a few years and then when they checked them the one at the higher altitude was slightly lagging behind the other one.

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I figured it was time to change my sig.

I asked my uncle about light-speed, and breaking it (he's a science teacher), and he said we could never break it, because objects have mass, light, however, does not have mass. Therefore, it can travel at it's speed. But then again, if you got the object to move that fast, would you even need headlights, technology-wise?
Zieg

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Originally posted by dudephil:

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Originally posted by elimc:
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Two young twins are separated at birth. One is sent the speed of light to another galaxy and back. When the twin arrives back to earth his brother has aged into an old man.

Pretty weird, but a couple of experiments have confirmed it.

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What experiments? You are getting too far away from logic and too close to scientific reasoning. There is a fine line between those. There is no way 2 people are born at the same time then find each other,lets say 50 years later,(no matter what) and are not the same age. It might be scientifically possible(in theory), but not PHYSICALLY possible. (Common sense)

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Most of quantum mechanics is counter-intuitive. There are a great couple of books called "Schroedinger's Kittens," though I can't remember who wrote them, which eplain many of them.

Though they don't make sense logically, as the author put it - quantum mechanics is the most thoroughly tested scientific theory in history. And most of our modern technology depends on it - including computers, lasers, telecommunications, etc.

Here is another twister for you:

If you shine a light on a slit in a piece of paper, it creates a single stripe of light on the wall beyond it. If you use two slits, you may expect to get two identical shadows, but instead you get a pattern of lines of different brightnesses. This is due to interference between the light waves (interference patterns).

But that ain't the half of it. If you send photons ("particles" of light) one at a time, you still get the pattern. So the photons have to go through BOTH SLITS AT THE SAME TIME.

But that still ain't the half of it. If you close one of the slits AFTER THE LIGHT PHOTON HAS GONE THROUGH IT, you get one single line. So that means that the photon "knows" ahead of time that the hole is going to be closed!

Bear in mind that this HAS BEEN TESTED. One theory on why this happens is that since light travels at the speed of light (duh) time is stopped for it - so each photon makes no distinction between the "time" it was emitted and the "time" it hits something.

Freaky, huh.

observer phenomenon at near c & underlying nuclear structures are only aspects of resonance/energy transfers, within the fundamental mechanism of the universe ... & these are somewhat beyond a brief post to this thread ...

"quantum mechanics are counter-intuitive..." - absolutely correct ...

"wormholes" - multidimensional/intramultidimensional boundary phenomenon - this is only 1 of various aspects - simply stated, this is where/when the mechanism of the universe "balances the ledger books" ...

"folding dimension" - dimensional planes are quasi-stable tight complex curves - CAN NOT fold - however, by altering frame-of-reference of observer, relative to "plane defining points" one can greatly reduce apparent distance between any 2 points - simple geometric constructs can not adequately represent this, accurately ...

"mass" - quasi-stable short term aspect of fundamental resonance/energy transfer/expression - what you refer to as "mass" merely reflects present brief resonance expression, on planet earth, now ...

"speed of light" - c is not constant, nor is it a Constant Value - it is simply one of the measures of "the ledgerbooks" ...

and finally, "well ordered states" are fundamentally rare & various aspects of entropy virtually dominate the universe ... you, your perception of "the world" & the sol/earth solar system do not represent the state/condition of the universe ... you, the observer, posting in this thread, have the most limited/distorted perception imagineable of space/time ... pls note that this only refers to your frame-of-reference ...

"as you approach the speed of light, mass becomes greater" - not really ...

"as you approach the speed of light, distances become shorter" - there are many aspects of "near c velocity" ... remember that the shortest distance between 2 defining points is a complex curve, because more then 3 dimensional planes will always be involved ...

1st, isolated individual aspects of the fundamental mechanism of the universe, simply can not be discussed/represented out of the totality of context, ...

2nd, secondary school physics classes must place greater emphasis on the aspects of uncertainty & resonance/energy transfer, & less emphasis on simplified structures ...

but keep questioning ...

[This message has been edited by ilkpc's (edited January 15, 2002).]

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Originally posted by ilkpc's:
[B"speed of light" - c is not constant, nor is it a Constant Value - it is simply one of the measures of "the ledgerbooks" ...

"as you approach the speed of light, distances become shorter" - there are many aspects of "near c velocity" ... remember that the shortest distance between 2 defining points is a complex curve, because more then 3 dimensional planes will always be involved ...
[/B]

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Maybe I just didn't understand your explanation, but as afar as I know, these are both wrong - they are inherrent to relativity.

The speed of light *IS* a constant in a vacuum and all observers will measure it to be constant regarless of their inertial frame of reference. I believe that is the essential premise of special relativity.

Your second statement there follows the first by implication. One major implication of relativity is that time is not constant. Since d=s*t, distance is therefore not a constant. Keeping in mind of course that ther are only 4 dimentions that we deal with in this equation - you can't apply distance to the 5th dimention (whatever it is) just like you can't apply distance to the 4th (time).

my apologies ... brevity often leads to inaccuracies ...

"vacuum" - an entirely human invention w/o meaning - the complete absence of resonance &/or resonance manifested as "matter" does not occur anywhere within the universe ... the value of c has been diminishing since the instant this universe, in which we find ourselves, came into existance; further c is a secondary aspect & interacts w/ gravity waves ... therefore c is not a constant value ...

the fundamentals underlying gravity phenomenon are genuine fundamentals of the mechanism of the universe ... it is exceeding important to focus research resources on developing comprehension of all aspects of gravity ... we will never understand the universe, unless we comprehend gravity ... & i am not refering to "why you don't fly off into space", rather the mechanism of gravity on all levels ... there are complex interactions ...

it is past time to allow albert einstein to rest in peace ... his consuming quest for grande unification, during his lifetime, distorted his perspective ... there are serious conflicts within relativistic mechanics & flaws within general relativity ... i attribute these to peer ignorance, early in the last century, resulting in isolation of einstein by many of the scientific community, who could have supported & furthered his work, but who did not ... his obsession w/ grande unification, during later years, is another matter altogether ... he did not advance w/ his peers & ended his days, again, largely isolated ...

we have differing perspectives ... several (journal) drafts, presently undergoing peer review, will very probably enlarge on the dissenting view that the value(s) of c vary ... there has also been some headway in measurement of gravity waves ... perhaps looking into thermodynamics applied to relativistic mechanics, w/ help abit ...

i respect your opinions, but i will remain w/ my own opinions ...

good luck

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Originally posted by ilkpc's:
my apologies ... brevity often leads to inaccuracies ...

"vacuum" - an entirely human invention w/o meaning - the complete absence of resonance &/or resonance manifested as "matter" does not occur anywhere within the universe ... the value of c has been diminishing since the instant this universe, in which we find ourselves, came into existance; further c is a secondary aspect & interacts w/ gravity waves ... therefore c is not a constant value ...

the fundamentals underlying gravity phenomenon are genuine fundamentals of the mechanism of the universe ... it is exceeding important to focus research resources on developing comprehension of all aspects of gravity ... we will never understand the universe, unless we comprehend gravity ... & i am not refering to "why you don't fly off into space", rather the mechanism of gravity on all levels ... there are complex interactions ...

it is past time to allow albert einstein to rest in peace ... his consuming quest for grande unification, during his lifetime, distorted his perspective ... there are serious conflicts within relativistic mechanics & flaws within general relativity ... i attribute these to peer ignorance, early in the last century, resulting in isolation of einstein by many of the scientific community, who could have supported & furthered his work, but who did not ... his obsession w/ grande unification, during later years, is another matter altogether ... he did not advance w/ his peers & ended his days, again, largely isolated ...

we have differing perspectives ... several (journal) drafts, presently undergoing peer review, will very probably enlarge on the dissenting view that the value(s) of c vary ... there has also been some headway in measurement of gravity waves ... perhaps looking into thermodynamics applied to relativistic mechanics, w/ help abit ...

i respect your opinions, but i will remain w/ my own opinions ...

good luck

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You have to use the right tool for the job, no matter what you are doing. In some areas Newtonian physics still reigns supreme. In others Maxwell’s wave equations are the way to go. Even though both of these have been superseded by newer theories and ideas there usefulness remains unquestioned.

The same is true for relativity. Despite it’s shortcomings, my knowledge it is generally accepted to be the best way to solve problems on a very large scale. Quantum mechanics is clearly dominant at the very small scale, but unless a lot has changed in the last 7 or 8 years it is like trying to fit square pegs in round holes when applied to the very large scale. To me this makes Relativity the obvious choice to answer the types of questions being discussed here, whatever it’s shortcomings.


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Life is complex. It has real and imaginary parts.

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Originally posted by jam544:
another fun fact to remember. As your speed increases, you will experience a distortion of distance.

in other words:
The faster you go the shorter the path you take.

If I traveled past the solar system traveling at 75% of the speed of light then the size of the solar system (relative to me) would only be 25% of its original size.

This is another interesting effect of high speeds. So if you are traveling near the speed of light. you have less distance to pass than a person moving slower.

[email protected]

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This is what I was getting at with my earlier question. Since distances shrink as you approach the speed of light you should in fact be able to get to a very distant point within your lifetime if you were traveling a significant fraction of the speed of light. Due to the effects of time dilation, the trip would seem much longer to other observers, but would seem fairly short to you.

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Life is complex. It has real and imaginary parts.

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Originally posted by Sinnersis:
c.) Wormholes work well! However wormholes can span time as well as space which means you could arrive before you left if you weren't careful!!!

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Maybe you could ask yourself (the other you who arrived) how the trip was BEFORE starting. https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/6.gif

These are the sort of absurdities we run into when time travel is "emulated" in our brains.

how is it possible to make ref to "vacuum" while ignoring zero point energy theory ...

it simply is not possible to compartmentise & create separate issues of discussion ... it all comes down to uncertainty & resonance/energy transforms ... surely it is apparent that c is merely a manifestation of quantum mechanics, & c is a secondary aspect ...

it fact very large scale phenomenon & very small scale phenomenon are merely different aspects of the same underlying fundamentals & are both entirely interdependent/codependent secondary aspects ... it is your changing frame-of-reference, nothing more ...

there is finally awareness that cosmology, theoretical physics & theoretical mathematics are converging, & MUST converge & be persued as a totality in order to achieve understanding of the mechanism of the universe ... it really is all the same thing ...

pls keep in mind that earlier research scientists, you have referenced, by their own admission, carried enormous religious baggage into their disciplines, greatly limiting their perspectives ... & i included einstein in this group ... heisenberg had greater clarity of mind ...

[This message has been edited by ilkpc's (edited January 16, 2002).]

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Originally posted by Rado:
Maybe you could ask yourself (the other you who arrived) how the trip was BEFORE starting. https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/6.gif

These are the sort of absurdities we run into when time travel is "emulated" in our brains.

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Exactly. Well put my friend.



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Enjoy life. There's plenty of time to be dead.
"Live as if your were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever."
-Mahatma Gandhi

This may be a simple problem but it has been bugging me. If you make a car that can travel at .9999999999999 the speed of light (which 1986 Ford Tauruses can do) and you turn on your headlights, will you be able to see the headlights in front of you?

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The light reflected back to you would most likely not lie within the visible spectrum due to doppler effect. So you would most likely not see it.

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the effect(s)/interaction of "exaggerated light beams" will be observable perpendicular to body vector ... near limit doppler shifts - you have not considered spectral shift(s)/distortion(s) due to irregular pulsed output of sae bulbs ...

[This message has been edited by ilkpc's (edited January 16, 2002).]