Creative screwing it's users long enough... this was the last straw ...

Seems the mod has edited the first post to reflect Creative's stance on the matter now -
We have read the strong feedback about Creative's forum post regarding driver development by Daniel_k and other outside parties. Creative's message posted on our behalf by our Company spokesperson tried to address our concern about the improper distribution of certain software which is the property of other companies. However, we did not make it as clear as we would have liked that we do support driver development by independent third parties. The huge task of developing driver updates to accommodate the many changes in the Vista operating system and the extensive testing required, including the lengthy Vista certification requirements for audio, makes it very difficult for Creative to develop updates for all past products. Outside developers have been very helpful to Creative and our customers by developing updates for many of our Sound Blaster products, and we do support and appreciate these efforts. This however does not extend to the unauthorized distribution of other companies' property. We hope to work out a mutually agreeable method for working with Daniel_k in supporting his efforts in driver development. Going forward, we are committed to doing a better job of working more closely with third parties to support their development for our products and our customers.

I think CL has finally seen the light after the great number of outraged posts at their attitude towards Daniel_k and its customers in general. Release better drivers to enable all the features I see when I was using XP, that's all I want. Anywayz, what do you guys think? A little too little, a little too late?

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Originally Posted by mikeysg

Anywayz, what do you guys think? A little too little, a little too late?

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Well, I think there are a couple things about this statement that Creative has yet to realize:
1. The press they've received in the last few days has generated a tremendous amount of ill will toward them. And by that, I mean, "crowds and crowds of enthusiasts no longer willing to buy their products." I'm not sure they realize exactly how badly they've screwed up. Which, if you've looked at their financials lately, is exactly the opposite of what they needed to do. Makes me want to short their stock...
2. They really should have just made a job offer to Daniel_k instead of C&D'ing him. In addition, they should have not done it publicly, on THEIR FORUM.
3. Their first statement was full of vague, useless marketing-speak even though it was directed at a single person. If you've checked their PR, it's always full of the same crap. They need to learn to talk to their customers as if we aren't complete idiots. Even the revised statement is practically devoid of information. This is how the statement should have read:

"We're sorry, we screwed up. The reason that we didn't release Vista support for DD encoding/passthrough is because we haven't paid Dolby a licensing fee yet [or whatever the actual reason is]. Daniel_k, you've done some great work. Please come fix our crappy driver development situation. Also, please stop distributing your version of the driver with DD support enabled in Vista so Dolby doesn't sue us into oblivion. Thanks!"

That's the big reason they released the C&D? Because he enabled Dolby support? That's the "Other companies software" they are talking about? I totally agree with all of your points. Man, this whole thing being caused by Dolby issues is a simple fix. Creative went at this completely wrong.

Sheesh. :mad:

As you mentioned, Creative's financials can't really take a mass exodus of their customers (I posted as much in my PCIe soundcard thread). Alas, I'm afraid that they will find that out the hard way.

to me it's a little too late.

the fudge up and now want to come crawling back.

the point is that this SHOULD NOT have happened in the first place. it's like a lover cheating on you and you found out. you don't looking at them the same again.

Creative is on my black list now.

along with these no rebate recieved scumbags:
Tiger Direct, Sapphire, Smilidon

It's a little late. I understand about Creative having certain legal responsibilities, they could have handled that better in the forums. But I stand by my remark I made back in the stone age that Creative needs to do what ATI did in the past with their video cards.

1. Admit that their drivers are way below par and are unexceptable.
2. Make it publically known that they are investing in a new effort to bring real quality to their drivers and thus confidence in their products.

Once ATI made that pledge with their Radeon line, they followed through and gained the respect of many as a result. Creative has been pretending that they don't have an issue and have remained in hiding since the begining.

At least on-board sound has been good enough to make it possible for most to ignore Creative altogether. It justs sucks that EAX is still a standard.

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Originally Posted by rhettro

At least on-board sound has been good enough to make it possible for most to ignore Creative altogether. It justs sucks that EAX is still a standard.

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You know, I've been reading several reviews lately (since I'm actually in the market for a sound card myself) and I have noticed something...nobody really seems to notice the EAX HD effects that are only found on Creative cards. I see a lot of, "We didn't really notice a difference, but there may have been a slightly 'fuller' sound due to the 3 extra versions of EAX," when people test Creative cards. Frankly, I'd take DDL and working Linux drivers over EAX 3/4/5 any day. The other benefits from the X-Fi (128 simultaneous voices, performance increases due to lesser CPU usage) are valid, but I dunno how much I'd pay for them at this point. I've got plenty of CPU to spare, honestly, and 32 voices is usually plenty for me.

(Current front-runner is the Bgears b-Enspirer, for those keeping track. It's the cheapest CMI8788 card available, AFAIK. Since I have an optical line running from my compy to my receiver, all the fancy analog output features of the HT Omega/Xonar don't really tempt me. If I didn't run Linux or dislike Creative, then the Prelude would probably be a close second.)

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Originally Posted by rimmerchant

to me it's a little too late.

the fudge up and now want to come crawling back.

the point is that this SHOULD NOT have happened in the first place. it's like a lover cheating on you and you found out. you don't looking at them the same again.

Creative is on my black list now.

along with these no rebate recieved scumbags:
Tiger Direct, Sapphire, Smilidon

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I totally agree ...the hams of justice have spoken ! Creative bad. However my Creative Zen plus blows away any stupid I-pod .

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Originally Posted by dimmy32

I totally agree ...the hams of justice have spoken ! Creative bad. However my Creative Zen plus blows away any stupid I-pod .

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LOL! True that!:D Heck, my iRiver E100 blows away any stupid Nano/iPod whatchamacallit....:D

I have yet to see anyone mention the rumor Creative is working on X-Fi 2 (for lack of an official name), designed with Vista in mind. Daniel_K's work with X-Fi's drivers was making the need for that card irrelevant, cutting into potential profits.

I think it is plausible Creative has disabled its own drivers to force us to buy new hardware... all under the guise of "lengthy Vista Certification".

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Originally Posted by Frraksurred

I have yet to see anyone mention the rumor Creative is working on X-Fi 2 (for lack of an official name), designed with Vista in mind. Daniel_K's work with X-Fi's drivers was making the need for that card irrelevant, cutting into potential profits.

I think it is plausible Creative has disabled its own drivers to force us to buy new hardware... all under the guise of "lengthy Vista Certification".

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I'm sure you are pretty much on the ball here.

When I first upgrade from my SB Live! (got in 1999) last year to a Xfi gamer was like WOW big difference.

but then I tried the other onboard audio on newer/recent mobo and it was like Wow better than SB live. but about same as XiFi.. so no point spending money on them now.



btw: error fix. my black list is: Tiger direct, Sapphire and RAIDMAX (not smilidon. that was the name of the damn case I got screwed over the rebate on, the company is raidmax)

Wow, all these educated opinions on Creative and their software....makes me dizzy and feeling a little uneducated.........here's my unsolicited and probably unwarranted minor opinion.

SCREW Creative....never liked them, never will, they've always been about the buck, and adding bloatware/intrusive ware to their products. Ef em.

Thank you and goodnite.

Educated? Spend 5 minutes on their forums, lol. It's all over.

I would love to dump Creative, unfortunately they've managed to run nearly every other decent 3D positional audio card maker out of business (with an inferior product). Some stout competiton is exactly what they need. Maybe then they'd stop abusing their customers.

Just a quick update on something I mentioned earlier.

X-Fi 2 is indeed in the works and near release. According to MS' site its Vista drivers were certified on 3/11/08 (page has been taken down now, but you can read about it here) and is rumored to release this August.

Unless it decodes all the new HD formats (TrueHD, DTS-HD), then I doubt it will amount to anymore then a Vista enabled X-Fi.

It has always struck me that Ceative has an interesting dichotomy between its hardware and its software. Mainly, that the central DSPs used in more recent products are quite impressive but that the drivers never really come up to snuff.

In addition, to make matters worse, Creative DSPs are impressive, but the hardware supporting them isn't always very good. If someone goes out of their way to create a great surround sound processing DSP, wouldn't it make sense to surround the DSP with better DACs and such?

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Originally Posted by mikeysg

I've installed the kX driver and I don't intend to DL any X-Fi driver from Creative anymore....at least, until they'd released a proper driver that brings back the full function of my X-Fi's (same functionality as with XP). Until then, I'm gonna hang with this modded driver.....tried a few games already, no problem whatsoever. The more I think about it, the angrier I get.......I suspect Creative could have enable these features a long time back (unless the driver team is totally THAT inapt) but have not done so due to whatever reasons they have. If they were trying to push consumers into getting X-Fi's, the very least they can do is to fully support their cards......I've had enough of their half-baked, buggy and crippled drivers!

Edit - Geez, that thread in my first post has taken a life of its own! >2.2k replies as of now.:eek:

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I'm confused. Are you saying you are using the kX driver for your X-Fi?

I was about to try and do the same thing when I saw this

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To reduce the rate of "Will kX work on X-Fi" threads that plague the kX forums, I will leave this thread "Stuck" for a while


kX only works on 10k1 and 10k2 based Soundblaster Live! and Audigy x series cards.

The X-Fi is NOT based on the 10kX architecture, and in the present state of kX, and CL's refusal to provide any form of information, kX will NOT support the X-Fi

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Source: http://www.driverheaven.net/general-...ster-x-fi.html



So, am I missing something here? Forgive me if it is obvious, it is late and I am tired ;)

-E-