C/C++ Programing

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Originally posted by Sol:
I have to agree with this, I wish there was a quick way to throw up some GUI items in Visual C++. At work we are currently using Java. It is so easy to slap together a GUI in java, I dont have much experience with Delphi, but I would love to see C++ have a really good way of developing a GUI. We have been talking about our next project and probably going with C++ so does anyone know of any compilers that you can prototype a GUI rather easily?

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I have to strongly DISAGREE with both of ya... I HATE the VB form builder, HATE HATE HATE it. I find the Res editor in Vis Studio to be much more usable in my case than the VB form builder. I notice other guis (like metrowerx on the Mac, I think...?) have this style of dialog editor in their stuff. Uggg... I can't say how much I hate that junk. To each his own I guess, there are enough of you who seem to like it. I did all my Windows programming in MFC though back in the day. I picked up VB once just for fun since it was installed by default with the VS crap along with Fox Pro and something else (fortran?), I guess it a full "enterprise" install deal. Played with the gui builder then tried to get a sample app built. One thing about this story: At the risk of sounding like I am a self-proclaimed Einstein here I picked up MFC by playing around with Visual C++ back in the 16 bit days, that was VC 1.5. I learned how to build simple apps and guis without once looking in the manuals or online help, I did this just by playing around with the framework. I tried this same approach with VB. Nuh-Ah. Wasn't going to happen. I screwed around for 3 days before I finally cracked and looked in the books. Bad practice, I know, but that is my measuring stick. I accept needing to look at docs to do low level, or complex stuff. But if it doesn't make sense to me right off the bat, I suspect the App writer, not me. Needless to say this left a very bad taste in my mouth regard vb. What can I tell ya?

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We have been talking about our next project and probably going with C++ so does anyone know of any compilers that you can prototype a GUI rather easily?

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If you want simple GUI layout go no further then Borland C++ Builder https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif I love it https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif As for VB, I dislike it because I hate programming in basic. But I still can't say I had an trouble building apps with it when I tried it out, without looking at help files or anything, just by clicking around. Maybe you used it before they made it make sense (though some would say it still doesn't make sense).

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My computer said "WindowsME/2000 or better" so I installed Linux.

[This message has been edited by jtshaw (edited November 01, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by jtshaw (edited November 02, 2000).]

hmmm not sure, but I dont think I said anything about VB. Most of those form builders, like the one in JBuilder is mainly for prototyping and thats what I am interested in right now. Most of my GUI design is done by coding and not done by app builders. Ive done all my programming in Java or C/C++, but C++ is what I would really like to get into in my next project. I can throw a quick GUI together in Java in just a little amount of time, where as in C++, its a little more difficult. Maybe I will just take the time and sit down for a week and get into Visual C++ or some other compiler a little more. https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif

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Originally posted by 100%TotallyNude:
I have to strongly DISAGREE with both of ya... I HATE the VB form builder, HATE HATE HATE it. I find the Res editor in Vis Studio to be much more usable in my case than the VB form builder. I notice other guis (like metrowerx on the Mac, I think...?) have this style of dialog editor in their stuff. Uggg... I can't say how much I hate that junk. To each his own I guess, there are enough of you who seem to like it. I did all my Windows programming in MFC though back in the day. I picked up VB once just for fun since it was installed by default with the VS crap along with Fox Pro and something else (fortran?), I guess it a full "enterprise" install deal. Played with the gui builder then tried to get a sample app built. One thing about this story: At the risk of sounding like I am a self-proclaimed Einstein here I picked up MFC by playing around with Visual C++ back in the 16 bit days, that was VC 1.5. I learned how to build simple apps and guis without once looking in the manuals or online help, I did this just by playing around with the framework. I tried this same approach with VB. Nuh-Ah. Wasn't going to happen. I screwed around for 3 days before I finally cracked and looked in the books. Bad practice, I know, but that is my measuring stick. I accept needing to look at docs to do low level, or complex stuff. But if it doesn't make sense to me right off the bat, I suspect the App writer, not me. Needless to say this left a very bad taste in my mouth regard vb. What can I tell ya?

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Thanks, I use JBuilder for Java, but the designer tool isn't that great because it puts it in some weird Borland XYLayout format... but I have heard from another friend that the C++ is rather good for GUI prototyping. thanks.

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Originally posted by jtshaw:
If you want simple GUI layout go no further then Borland C++ Builder https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif I love it https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif As for VB, I dislike it because I had programming in basic. But I still can't say I had an trouble building apps with it when I tried it out, without looking at help files or anything, just by clicking around. Maybe you used it before they made it make sense (though some would say it still doesn't make sense).

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Originally posted by Sol:
(various comments about C++ Builder)

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Also be aware that Borland has licensed MFC, thus if you have some legacy VC++ apps around, Borland C++ Builder should be able to compile most of it off the bat... (best of both worlds)

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Rune

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Originally posted by BikeDude:
Also be aware that Borland has licensed MFC, thus if you have some legacy VC++ apps around, Borland C++ Builder should be able to compile most of it off the bat... (best of both worlds)

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Rune

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Thanks for the help!

You can visit www.opengl.org for some information concern with open-gl or get this book "Open-gl super bible"...

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Better to have loved and lost, than to have never loved at all

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Originally posted by Arcadian:
That's like telling a perspective artist to try a Disney coloring book before that person experiments with paint https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif. VB might be an acceptible language for writing the UI for a simple Windows app, but for video games, you definately need to go with C/C++. If I were to suggest a beginner's language, I would recommend Pearl or Java. VB is too bloated, and not nearly as robust. (However, to prevent myself from looking like a hypocrite, let me point out that Pearl and Java are bloated as well, but at least they have they are more widely used in terms of the Internet, and you're more likely to get a better introduction to real programming with them https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif).

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So you think those classes, oop and library are much easier than COBOL and FOTRAN?

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Better to have loved and lost, than to have never loved at all

Not sure, but from one article I read on C Sharp, it seems that it is a "Visual Basic with a C-interface", meaning that the language is syntactically similar to C, but carries the "features" (bloat) of VB.

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Originally posted by moman_99:
Not sure, but from one article I read on C Sharp, it seems that it is a "Visual Basic with a C-interface", meaning that the language is syntactically similar to C, but carries the "features" (bloat) of VB.

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I.e. Java with (yet another) new spin on it.

C# has some great features and some new ideas (and a great architect: Anders Hejlsberg) and all, but I'd strongly advice against using something MS doesn't use themselves (e.g. MS never used VB).

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Rune

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Originally posted by moman_99:
Not sure, but from one article I read on C Sharp, it seems that it is a "Visual Basic with a C-interface", meaning that the language is syntactically similar to C, but carries the "features" (bloat) of VB.

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C# is a lot like java with a few spins. I am really not sure what to think about this. Currently on my project we are using Java, but some of the higher up people like to use bleeding edge technology so I am sure I will have to dable with it some soon.

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Originally posted by Sol:
C# is a lot like java with a few spins. I am really not sure what to think about this. Currently on my project we are using Java, but some of the higher up people like to use bleeding edge technology so I am sure I will have to dable with it some soon.

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C# Is nothing more than Microsoft's latest attempt to horn in on Java. One of the comments from a C# engineer: "We created C# becuase we missed a lot of features of C; like ennumerated types. Why do away with those?" I'm paraphrasing of course, but thats the gist. Its a fine point, but, in a truly object-oriented language ennumerated types aren't nessessary. You can create objects that inherit ennumeration, just like you can create objects that do anything. Thats the whole point of OOP. I would dare to blatently accuse M$ of being very pissed off at not having thought of Java first, and having based 90% of thier money and future on C++. While currently still a nessessary language for doing stuff like device drivers, it couldn't have stayed the enterprise language forever. The computer is the Network now, and having each and every little device connected to the Network speaking a different language isn't going to work.


[This message has been edited by 100%TotallyNude (edited November 08, 2000).]

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Originally posted by Sol:
C# is a lot like java with a few spins. I am really not sure what to think about this. Currently on my project we are using Java, but some of the higher up people like to use bleeding edge technology so I am sure I will have to dable with it some soon.

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What exactly are you doing with Java? I'm taking a course right now, introducing all the basic concepts. Such as I/O, GUI, Database connectivity, and hopefully some networking. I found that the language is very slow. Does this seem to be a problem with real applications in the career world? Do companies back away because of its lack of speed or do they say "I need something that will run on UNIX, Windows, Solaris, etc"? Sorry if this topic was already talked aobut, didn't feel like reading though 75 posts.

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- jeste®

How could tomorrow ever follow today?

Heh, I have broken my EverQuest addiction long enough to get back in touch w/other projects (yeah, right). I've almost finished that book I mentioned earlier...As with many things I have taken the time to learn; it turns out that the things I thought would be difficult to do (translation transformations), are fairly simple while things I didn't consider at all (texture mapping, data base manipulation) are comparatively difficult.
As far as which language to use: I wish I could use Pascal because I think it is an elegant language as far as elegence applies to such a thing. I think C/C++ is much more powerful, but more tedious to work with; but it's what the games are written in, so C/C++ is what I will use. As far as C or C++ goes, I think that using both is the way to go. Many of the core graphics functions/structures really don't have to be object-oriented (and thusly might be faster), but the database stuff screams out for classes.
I think OpenGL is definitely the way to go; thanks for the great refs on this. https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif

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Originally posted by jester:
What exactly are you doing with Java? I'm taking a course right now, introducing all the basic concepts. Such as I/O, GUI, Database connectivity, and hopefully some networking. I found that the language is very slow. Does this seem to be a problem with real applications in the career world? Do companies back away because of its lack of speed or do they say "I need something that will run on UNIX, Windows, Solaris, etc"? Sorry if this topic was already talked aobut, didn't feel like reading though 75 posts.

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The company I am with is developing a multi-tier application. Yes, it is slow, but speed is not that big of an issue. The program, for what it's supposed to do, runs perfectly fine in Java. Right now I do a lot of GUI work. We have three people, one working on DB connectivity, a middle tier person (ejb) and a GUI man. I am also working on an R&D project with web phones. It is probably better to concentrate on the theories behind it, instead of learnign just the Java. I started off with c++ and migrated over to Java and a lot of the concepts carry over. good luck.