Creative screwing it's users long enough... this was the last straw ...

Guys , I dunno where u have been, but Creative PCIex1 cards exist for queit some time (2007) and selling too :

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16829102017

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...2E16829102016R

http://c1.neweggimages.com/NeweggIma...102-017-04.jpg

https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/...2008/05/40.jpg

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Originally Posted by Hammerstein

It has always struck me that Ceative has an interesting dichotomy between its hardware and its software. Mainly, that the central DSPs used in more recent products are quite impressive but that the drivers never really come up to snuff.

In addition, to make matters worse, Creative DSPs are impressive, but the hardware supporting them isn't always very good. If someone goes out of their way to create a great surround sound processing DSP, wouldn't it make sense to surround the DSP with better DACs and such?

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I have to agree with all this. I have noticed this myself.

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Originally Posted by Frraksurred

I would love to dump Creative, unfortunately they've managed to run nearly every other decent 3D positional audio card maker out of business (with an inferior product). Some stout competiton is exactly what they need. Maybe then they'd stop abusing their customers.

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I agree.

Unfortunately, I don't see it happening. As far as gaming sound goes, they have a near monopoly. And sound cards isn't a winner for a new company to come in and try starting to compete.

I was (and still am on Win9X and old games) a A3D 2.0 disciple.

But I had read somewhere when the X-Fi first came out that their new EAX had heavily used A3D in it. And I have noticed myself that it seems to be pretty good positional sound in gaming.

Unfortunately, this is about as good as it's going to get I think...

This is BS... No I am not talking about creative, but about the lame losers who are outraged because creative doesnt want another site/person to release drivers for their product?

Are you stupid?

I love my creative products, ever since my Soundblaster Pro and I will continue to support them. Until proven otherwise/better product out there for my needs, which there isnt.

If you are a web developer, and someone else stolen your template, you would ask them to remove it. Same thing!

No disrespect Colossus, but have you read their complaints? The options Daniel_K was enabling in Creative's drivers are abilities the cards once had but Creative had since disabled. He is not stealing anything from them, he is simply making the cards fully functional again.

Were he cutting into their sales or making money by duplicating their IP, then I would completely agree with you.

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Originally Posted by Frraksurred

No disrespect Colossus, but have you read their complaints? The options Daniel_K was enabling in Creative's drivers are abilities the cards once had but Creative had since disabled. He is not stealing anything from them, he is simply making the cards fully functional again.

Were he cutting into their sales or making money by duplicating their IP, then I would completely agree with you.

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But the thing is...

It is their card and drivers... However.... I checked the specs of my X-Fi Platinum and it does not mention about built-in decoding...

http://us.creative.com/products/prod...ct=16559&nav=1

So if his drivers is enabling something that wasnt originally included. They deserve every right to request him to stop. And the end-user cannot be upset.

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Originally Posted by Colossus

So if his drivers is enabling something that wasnt originally included. They deserve every right to request him to stop. And the end-user cannot be upset.

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I agree that Creative has every right to ask him to stop. I also think that it's a very stupid thing to do on Creative's part... and that by threatening him that they just cast themself in even a worse light in the eyes of the customer.

And I whole heartedly disagree that the end user cannot be upset.

I have every right to be upset as a Creative customer. Because I think that Creative is holding back on me. I think that Creative isn't putting their best product forth. I think that Creative is being a greedy monopoly. And such moves on Creative's part... and this end user being upset WILL weigh in on my decision to buy future products from them (I am stopping short of a full boycott... but I will stop and consider this little act of theirs when thinking about buying their product).

This decoding function isn't mentioned on my Fatal1ty FPS but IS mentioned on my ExtremeMusic IIRC....will check and post a pic if necessary. I think that's one of the reason why they'd stopped selling it....will be back with pics.

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Originally Posted by Colossus

But the thing is...

It is their card and drivers... However.... I checked the specs of my X-Fi Platinum and it does not mention about built-in decoding...

http://us.creative.com/products/prod...ct=16559&nav=1

So if his drivers is enabling something that wasnt originally included. They deserve every right to request him to stop. And the end-user cannot be upset.

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OK, big C, I'm back with a pic of the DTS-ES/DD-EX decoding function on my ExtremeMusic -
https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/...2008/05/25.jpg
IF the XM has this function, should it not be extended to the more expensive Fatal1ty/Pro/Elite as well?

Edit - BTW, this decoding function isn't available with the X-Fi Vista driver from Creative, only Daniel K's driver enable it. That's why I'm quite PO'd with Creative for disabling a function that I'd paid for when I'd bought their card. For my HTPC build (which uses the ExtremeMusic card), I'd to get their DTS-610 to get DTS sound for my movies....was I not cheated by Creative?

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Originally Posted by mikeysg

Seems the mod has edited the first post to reflect Creative's stance on the matter now -
We have read the strong feedback about Creative's forum post regarding driver development by Daniel_k and other outside parties. Creative's message posted on our behalf by our Company spokesperson tried to address our concern about the improper distribution of certain software which is the property of other companies. However, we did not make it as clear as we would have liked that we do support driver development by independent third parties. The huge task of developing driver updates to accommodate the many changes in the Vista operating system and the extensive testing required, including the lengthy Vista certification requirements for audio, makes it very difficult for Creative to develop updates for all past products. Outside developers have been very helpful to Creative and our customers by developing updates for many of our Sound Blaster products, and we do support and appreciate these efforts. This however does not extend to the unauthorized distribution of other companies' property. We hope to work out a mutually agreeable method for working with Daniel_k in supporting his efforts in driver development. Going forward, we are committed to doing a better job of working more closely with third parties to support their development for our products and our customers.

I think CL has finally seen the light after the great number of outraged posts at their attitude towards Daniel_k and its customers in general. Release better drivers to enable all the features I see when I was using XP, that's all I want. Anywayz, what do you guys think? A little too little, a little too late?

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Why would we trust them? What 3rd party software are they referring to? Honestly, they are just infusing PR with the resources to mute the problem, but not actually fix it until they provide an actual timeline to resolve the problem at a minimum.

Their "fix" will come in the form of the "X-Fi 2". They choose to disable decoding in Vista for the X-Fi to create a void for the X-Fi 2 to fill. Daniel_K's work potentially cuts into those sales.

This would normally be viewed and standard every day business decision had Creative not taken away a feature they advertised for the X-Fi and we payed for as Mike already pointed out.

When you add this to the terrible driver support and decrease in build quality from the Creative we used to know... can you not see where their customers would be upset?

Creative just launched that X-Fi Titanium PCI-Express, I just find the timing of this release funny. Asus just started making waves with their D2X Xonar PCI-E, and now Creative conveniently comes up with this. First they rip off people with that Audigy 2 PCI-E labelled as a X-Fi, and now they can release a PCI-E card when they claimed they had difficulties making one.

Back in the day, I used a Gravis Ultrasound Max for my PC gaming. I have used AWE64, and Live! and never liked them as much as my Ultrasound. I currently have a X-Fi, but meh, I bought it for $20 bucks CDN brand new. Received a massive discount when the X-Treme Music was being discontinued.

Daniel_k has given up, this is his response to a 2nd letter from Creative. There'll be no more modded drivers from him......and I'll NEVER buy another Creative card ever again! :mad: When my XM and Fatal1ty die on me, or when I feel that there's a viable replacement for them from Auzentech/Asus, I'll jump ship and go for theirs instead. It's clear as day in the pic I'd posted, DTS-ES and DD-EX decoding and yet they failed to deliver on their word.....screw them!:mad: It's about principle, something that Creative is in dire need of........