The Official NFL Thread

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Originally Posted by rabidmoose171

I think what is being said is... the Heisman trophy doesn't mean jack ****!

He got the trophy, and he got drafted high, now he makes a ton of money, if they take the trophy away he isn't going to lose his money.

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Exactly.

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Originally Posted by vairox

actually he will be remembered as the only guy who got the heisman taken away from him.

He had maybe 3 good plays this season... definitely did not live up to the hype but he has plenty of time to put on weight and adjust his game to the NFL's speed.

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Wow, I'm not even a Reggie Bush fan but if you think he didn't live up to the "hype" then you're nuts. Hell before the season started he had very little hype, no one even expected him to do that much just be a good backup when Deuce needed a breather.

He was a huge playmaker for the Saints this season, and a major part of why they made it to the NFC championship game. Its not just his stats that impress people either, the whole Saints team gets pumped up every time he does his crazy juke moves to break a run, let alone how the crowd gets loud and jacked up when he gets in the game.

Anyway back to the Heisman thing, I don't agree with him taking money, but like I said earlier in this thread, a crapload of colleges and players do this sort of thing, it just doesn't come to light like it does when its on a grand stage like the Heisman winner.

And Reggie was already voted the greatest college football player last year, how do his actions off the field change what he did on the field? Like I already said, I don't agree with what he did off the field, but that doesn't change any of his stats for what he accomplished on the field.

I really hate it when so many athletes always get judged by what they did off the field instead of what they did on it, classic examples are like trying to keep Lawrence Taylor out of the HoF because of his drug charges, or similar to Pete Rose because of his gambling.

Anyway, I'm done venting for now, you can take away Reggie's Heisman, but if they give it to Vince Young there will always be an asterisk by his name in the history books that states he really came in second in the voting and won by a technicality.

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Originally Posted by vairox

actually he will be remembered as the only guy who got the heisman taken away from him.

He had maybe 3 good plays this season... definitely did not live up to the hype but he has plenty of time to put on weight and adjust his game to the NFL's speed.

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3 good plays? where does that come from. I'm not a Bush fan, but thats kinda harsh.

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Originally Posted by Gar

I really hate it when so many athletes always get judged by what they did off the field instead of what they did on it, classic examples are like trying to keep Lawrence Taylor out of the HoF because of his drug charges, or similar to Pete Rose because of his gambling.

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They talk a good game about Taylor and Michael Irvin not getting in, but there's no way they actually keep them out. The difference with Pete Rose is that he didn't just have a gambling problem, he bet on the sport he plays. Plenty of athletes have gambling problems that they talk about in the open, but when you bet on your own sport, that's something different. He says he never bet on any games that he was in (which is obviously bad because he could throw the outcome of the game to win his bet), but he also went for decades saying that he never bet on baseball at all.

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Originally Posted by vairox

actually he will be remembered as the only guy who got the heisman taken away from him.

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Not that that's any better. My point is that if he ends up with no sort of NFL career for some reason or another, having the Heisman yanked is all he'll really be remembered for, not really for his great college career. Ryan Leaf was great in college, but what do we all remember about him? The Heisman thing won't be as big if Bush ends up being a Hall of Famer, though it will still be brought up constantly.

Well after last year's performance, I don't think there's a big chance of Bush not making a name for himself in the NFL, unless he has a career ending injury.

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Originally Posted by Boneycat

Well after last year's performance, I don't think there's a big chance of Bush not making a name for himself in the NFL, unless he has a career ending injury.

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Which is why I specifically mentioned injury as a reason for him not living up to his potential. It wouldn't be unheard of for a player to drop off substantially after one great year, anyway. Take away Brees or McCallister's inside presence and he may start looking more ordinary pretty quickly. Remember, it wasn't too long ago that Michael Vick was making Pro Bowls on his way to changing the way the entire game of football is played; now there's been talk of him not improving year after year and possibly getting traded.

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Originally Posted by monroeski

Which is why I specifically mentioned injury as a reason for him not living up to his potential. It wouldn't be unheard of for a player to drop off substantially after one great year, anyway. Take away Brees or McCallister's inside presence and he may start looking more ordinary pretty quickly. Remember, it wasn't too long ago that Michael Vick was making Pro Bowls on his way to changing the way the entire game of football is played; now there's been talk of him not improving year after year and possibly getting traded.

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Yea, but even hall of famers are reliant on the fact that this is a team game more so than any other sport (imho :p). You could have put a hall of fame quarter back or running back on my Lions team last year and they would have been mediocre.

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Originally Posted by spamjedi

Yea, but even hall of famers are reliant on the fact that this is a team game more so than any other sport (imho :p). You could have put a hall of fame quarter back or running back on my Lions team last year and they would have been mediocre.

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Which only goes to further prove my point. He could be awesome, but if the Saints turn back into the team they've been for basically their entire history sans last year, that would be a pretty good chunk of an RB's career lost.

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Originally Posted by monroeski

Which only goes to further prove my point. He could be awesome, but if the Saints turn back into the team they've been for basically their entire history sans last year, that would be a pretty good chunk of an RB's career lost.

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gotcha.


as a side note... the wife and I saw commercials for Pans Labrinth the other night and it looks pretty intersting. Its that good eh? I'm refering to your sig btw.

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Originally Posted by monroeski

Which only goes to further prove my point. He could be awesome, but if the Saints turn back into the team they've been for basically their entire history sans last year, that would be a pretty good chunk of an RB's career lost.

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That's a big "if" and you're assuming a lot. I'm not sure what your point is in all of this. The issue at hand is whether or not he deserves to have the Heisman taken away from him, not "if" he get's hurt "if" the Saints start to suck or "if" Katrina Two hits N.O. again destroying the whole town. The bottom line is he broke the rules. Period. I don't give a rats *** "if" he goes down in history as the guy who lost his Heisman. The good news for him is that he has already made his money.

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Originally Posted by spamjedi

gotcha.


as a side note... the wife and I saw commercials for Pans Labrinth the other night and it looks pretty intersting. Its that good eh? I'm refering to your sig btw.

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i think it's a really good movie and twist on the narrative of a fairy tale. The great Yokai War is pretty good as well by Miike.

Back to the NFL Reggie Bush is a great player with so much potential and I hope NO will use him more next season. He really really brought hope and reenergized the team and city with his play.

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Originally Posted by hongsc

i think it's a really good movie and twist on the narrative of a fairy tale. The great Yokai War is pretty good as well by Miike.

Back to the NFL Reggie Bush is a great player with so much potential and I hope NO will use him more next season. He really really brought hope and reenergized the team and city with his play.

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Heh, really, how much more can they use him? He does kickoff and punt returns, RB, and when Deuce is in at tailback they put him off in the slot or as a WR. There's no doubt about his speed and endurance as shown by that first bone crushing hit against the Bears and his 90 yard catch and run in the same game.

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Originally Posted by Boneycat

Heh, really, how much more can they use him? He does kickoff and punt returns, RB, and when Deuce is in at tailback they put him off in the slot or as a WR. There's no doubt about his speed and endurance as shown by that first bone crushing hit against the Bears and his 90 yard catch and run in the same game.

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I know they used him in a variety of ways just like USC but I didn't see him a lot in games.

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Originally Posted by Boneycat

That's a big "if" and you're assuming a lot. I'm not sure what your point is in all of this. The issue at hand is whether or not he deserves to have the Heisman taken away from him, not "if" he get's hurt "if" the Saints start to suck or "if" Katrina Two hits N.O. again destroying the whole town. The bottom line is he broke the rules. Period. I don't give a rats *** "if" he goes down in history as the guy who lost his Heisman. The good news for him is that he has already made his money.

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Actually, the issue at hand is whether or not it hurts him to have the Heisman taken away from him, and I think it does. Just because he's already signed ONE NFL contract (which is non guaranteed money) and some endorsement deals and had ONE fairly good season doesn't mean that the Heisman is now worthless. If it's taken away, anything short of a Hall of Fame NFL career from him and he basically just goes down in history as the guy that had his Heisman taken away.

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Originally Posted by monroeski

Actually, the issue at hand is whether or not it hurts him to have the Heisman taken away from him, and I think it does. If it's taken away, anything short of a Hall of Fame NFL career from him and he basically just goes down in history as the guy that had his Heisman taken away.

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I agree.
I don't think the NCAA is done with this issue at all. How do you think USC feels about all of this? Bush got the Hiesman and a fat paycheck. What did USC get? Screwed.