What Language To Start With?

OK, ive finally decided im tired of hearing the 'parental units' telling me that all I do is play games on the computer all the time and that I should do something productive.... ok ok, guess I will. Ive always wanted to learn to program, so Ive decided to start now. I was wondering what language you guys (and ladies?) suggest starting off with. All I pretty much know programming wise (doubt this is really considered a programming langauge) basic/advanced HTML Read Eric Raymonds 'Cathedral and the Bazaar' and he suggests going with Python first. Was wondering what everyone else thought. Thanks...


------------------
1mmorta1

1.2 gig AMD T-Bird
256 PC133 RAM
ELSA Gladiac GeForce2 GTS
SBLive! XGamer
21in KDS Monitor
Klipsch v.2-400 Surround Sound Speakers

What do you want to do with your programming? Do you want to make games? Make simple Windows apps? Make simple DOS apps? Make useful Windows apps? Internet-based development? Depending on what your answer is, I'd recommend either C/C++, Java, VB, or perhaps Delphi.

Well, the main thing Id like to do is program games (going to start with mods first). Later on I'd like to get into small Win app building, but Id like to start with the fun stuff, programming mods/games.



------------------
1mmorta1

1.2 gig AMD T-Bird
256 PC133 RAM
ELSA Gladiac GeForce2 GTS
SBLive! XGamer
21in KDS Monitor
Klipsch v.2-400 Surround Sound Speakers

The first language I learnt was GW Basic, now known as QBasic... hehe. It helped me, but I doubt you want to learn something as backward as that. I don't know what to suggest, but I feel that I should let you know that the Python tutorials online are written in such a way that your face might collide with the keyboard in no time. [i.e. they put ME to sleep.. they might to the same for you] I never programmed in Python, because I didn't get far enough in the tutorials. I'm going to start learning c++ really soon at school. I'll let you know how that goes.

------------------
Can't sleep, clowns will eat me...
Can't sleep, clowns will eat me...
Can't sleep, clowns will eat me...

I would start out with VB becuase you will be able to DirectX programming in it soon.

It doesn't really matter what you learn, as all imperative languages are essentially the same. C is a very "dirty" language, ideally suited to language hackers, but yet it is widely used. But it doesnt matter that much, the skills you learn in one can easily be transferred to another, the differences are mainly in the syntax (apart from bizzare declarative programming languages, like SML)

------------------
"If we don't succeed, we run the risk of failure." - G.W.Bush.

Good luck America!

Java or C#/C++ is good if you ever plan to study https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/6.gif

Actually they are useful, full stop.

------------------
Now listening to:
At the Drive-in - relationship of command

T-Bird 1000@1100Mhz

Visual Basic is really easy, and you can do most of the programs with it, but these programs won't be cross-platform, they will just run on Windows. Programing 3d games might be a very difficult task, it is not that easy.
If you want to learn a real and complex language, C++.

Also Visual Basic has a very good string management routines, and the structure of basic programs are much easier to understand than C.

------------------
--- Dan

AMD K7 Athlon 700
128 MB RAM
Voodoo 3 2000

17y

There are programming concept books out there that doesn't teach you a specific language but tells you everything you need to know about object-oriented programming.
After reading those book(s), it will be a snap to learn all the major languages like C++ and Java.
I first learned Pascal in school... it was really helpful... no confusing keywords (like Java) and builds a really solid foundation in programming.

------------------
K6-200, 32MB EDORAM, 3.2GB, Voodoo2 12MB, integrated sound

Being both Pascal based and object-oriented Borland's (Inprise) Delphi is a very good one to start with. I use VC6 myself but I have fond memories of the Turbo Pascal and their assembler back in the DOS days.
Delphi's VCL will let you code without too much worry about the GUI stuff and is a good basis for all other languages.

I started with PASCAL and am now learning C++. I found that PASCAL wasn't that difficult to learn, and as previously stated, gives a good beginning foundation in programming. Learning C++ now (with a background in another language) is a lot easier than it would have been without prior experience. I would say start with a language that someone in your vicinity could help you with, should you run into trouble. Actually doing hands-on programming with someone to guide you (in person) is a big help with whatever language you choose.

PASCAL is an excellent language to start off with, I'm learning it in school now (high school freshman). It's really simple though more complex then BASIC and teaches you good form. Once you gain an understanding of PASCAL, you can move onto more complex languages like C++.

------------------
Overclocking rice... nice concept?

I started off in PASCAL, then moved onto C++. I think at my old university they are teaching Java first now instead of PASCAL.

------------------
new sig: when its done

Quote:

---

Originally posted by dague12:
Visual Basic is really easy, and you can do most of the programs with it, but these programs won't be cross-platform, they will just run on Windows. Programing 3d games might be a very difficult task, it is not that easy.
If you want to learn a real and complex language, C++.

Also Visual Basic has a very good string management routines, and the structure of basic programs are much easier to understand than C.

---

I wouldn't recommend a BASIC language at all for the beginning programmer, it teaches too many bad habits (like goto) that have to be un-learned when you decide to drop the kid's language(VB) and go to a man's language(C++).



------------------
What?!

I would go with Java, it has many structures identical to C++, except it doesn't recommend a windows based system

------------------
Temporary Tatoos, up and down you're arm, they only cost a quarter AND YOU GET FREE PLASTIC CHARMS!

when did most of you guys(gals?) start to get into programming? I've messed around with it some but I can't really get he hang of it by myself(I can make some worthless little programs in VB) I'm a freshman in high school, but the only programming class they have is available to juniors and seniors, and all they teach you is qbasic. oh well.

also is there a whole lot of math involved? I will be able to squeeze in calculus by the end of high school if i would need it.

I think python is a very good language to start with. It has very good balance between power and structure. You'll get an early start with object orientation. The only problem is that after mastering python every other language looks so poorly designed =P

FYI: I started programming in a form of basic originnaly found on the Commodore 64...now there's a language :P.

Anyway, I'd say that starting in Pascal is a good idea. It has the basics of programming that more "professional" languages such as C++/Java without requiring you to learn the large list of object heirarchies such as those associated with most object oriented languages. Pascal allows you to experiment with simple concepts easily while simultaneously teaching syntax and programming concepts that other languages use. Although I have only used it a little, Delphi appears to be a good way to learn more advanced programming in Pascal and can be used to easily make GUI applications.

On the other hand, if you are looking to dive in the deep end, VC++ or Java should be what you use.

Whatever you do, make sure that you buy a book or two about the language you choose. If you choose the right book, you'll be glad you did it and use it for reference for years to come.

------------------
TBird 800 / TNT2

Quote:

---

Originally posted by FUZZYrice:
PASCAL is an excellent language to start off with, I'm learning it in school now (high school freshman). It's really simple though more complex then BASIC and teaches you good form. Once you gain an understanding of PASCAL, you can move onto more complex languages like C++.

---

same here cept im a junior, pascal is EXTREMELY easy, it teaches you the basics of almost every single language out there. You learn the concepts and idea behind programming. Ived look at c++ and it seems more complex but i do have a better understanding of it because of pascal..
pascal is my recommendation



------------------
I am building a new computer from stratch.am i crazy?? :)
muahaha sucess
1ghz amd Tbird
256 pc133 CL2 crucial ram
Geforce 2 mx 32mb
Altec Lansing 5piece surround sound
SB LIVE Xgamer
17" crystal scan
8x4x32 CDRW
50Xcd

If you're into designing games, maybe you should start with level editor found in games like Quake and Unreal. These allow you to make major creative steps without trying to reinvent the wheel. Then try to modify someone else's code and you will start to understand the structure of the code.

But any language you decide on, try to examine existing code and use that as a base to write your own programs, you can learn more from someone else's code than from books.

Sal

If you want to seriously learn, go with java or c++. If you want to have something to keep your parents off your back, or if you have a low opinion of your mental capabilites, go with VB.
Everything else is a waste.

My personal recommendation is c++.
Java just doesn't cut it for me, because of the lack of pointers and performance issues.
I've used it for some basic stuff(a simple html web server), and it has great libraries.

I learned basic when i was in 2nd grade, played with that for a little, then picked up c++ in 11th grade.

<soap box>
If you want to make stupid little dialogs, learn VB. If you want to write easy internet progs, learn java. If you want to do anything wiht opengl/directx, definitely c++ is the way to go.

Don't bother with visual c++ at all, at first. If you really want to make windows programs, MFC is great, but learn everything from the console. visual is only an API. general c++ will take you much farther.

</soap box>

Sorry to break this to you, but C/C++ has a goto statement. I would never use it, but it is there. I would say of all languages, C/C++ is responsible for the vast majority of the worlds programming sins. And of all programmers, self taught C/C++ hackers are responsible for a large part of said sinning. If you want to learn good programming habits, Java would be the language to go with.

That said, the problem with starting out with Java (or C/C++ for that matter) is that you have to put in a lot of hard work and study to get to the point where you are doing anything more complicated than printing text from a user interface point of view. Thus, I would have to recommend VB as a first language, even though it is not a good language for advanced programming. The reason is that VB rewards the programmer quickly by allowing him/her to create user interface components that actually work in very little time with very little hassle. This is ideal for the beginning programmer. As a programmer becomes more adept, they will naturally move away from VB and into faster, more powerful languages.

-thehutt-

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jcadam:
[B] I wouldn't recommend a BASIC language at all for the beginning programmer, it teaches too many bad habits (like goto) that have to be un-learned when you decide to drop the kid's language(VB) and go to a man's language(C++).

If u want to get seriously get into programming i'd advise that u start off with C/C++ or Java. I started out with C++, then i started getting into the more base code of C. I think it is one of the more versatile programming languages. Then again i'm pretty bias toward it cause i've been programming in it for close to 2 years.

------------------
GO NAVY! - BEAT ARMY!

Whew.... 1mmorta1 here, that was my old account (formatted, etc https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/6.gif and I ended up making this new account. Thanks to all who have replied to my post. I have decided to dive into the deep end and go with C++ and work my way out from there. Again, thanks for the overwhelming responce Ive received on my question https://www.sharkyforums.com/images/.../2005/06/5.gif

------------------
Killer1nstinct

1.2 gig AMD T-Bird
512 PC133 RAM
ELSA Gladiac GeForce2 GTS
SBLive! X-Gamer 5.1
52x CD-Rom
12x DVD Rom
12x8x32 HP CD-RW
21in KDS Monitor
Klipsch v.2-400 Surround Sound Speakers
Windows 98