Low frame rates in Thief 3, just like Deus Ex 2

[chris20202]

I have Thief 3 (Thief, deadly shadows), and the bad news is, the frame rates are just as low as they were in Deus Ex 2.

Lots of people complained that Deus Ex 2 seemed to be totally unoptimized for the PC. Now that they've put out a 2nd game with the same engine, with equally low frame rates, it seems that it's just a really horrible game engine.

For some additional info on the game, I'll cut and paste another message I wrote on another forum:

"... in Deus ex 2, I used to turn off the shadows entirely, which helped. But you can't do that here in Thief 3, so the frame rate will be worse than deus ex 2.

Some advice:

#1: Very Important - turn off vsync! At least on my graphics card, a geforce fx 5900, due I believe to shoddy programming in the game, having vsync on means your frame rate will be fixed to some fraction of your refresh rate. That is, if your refresh rate is 85hz, your frame rate will be either 85, 42, 28, 21, etc. Meaning if it should have been 60, you will get only 42. If it should have been 41, you will get only 28. etc. Unless you want to take a massive hit to your frame rate, turn vsync off!

#2. Turning on 3rd person mode cuts your frame rate by 10% to 30%. This is rather a huge amount, so I recommend not using it unless necessary to see around corners or whatever.


I am forced to play this game at 1024x768, which is ridiculous considering that I can play Far Cry at 1280x960. And now I can see why the game reviewers criticized the graphics. They don't look too good, especially because of the pseudo-1st person mode.

You are never actually in 1st person, switching to 1st person merely moves your 3rd person view into the front of the head of your 3rd person character, but he is still there moving around, which makes all of your movement jerky and clumsy.

There are various graphics options which theoretically could improve the look of the game or improve the frame rate by turning them off, but they seem to have only a small effect on the frame rate, so you might as well leave them turned on and have the game look as good as it can.

This really must be the crappiest game engine ever, it's amazing how it manages to produce such low frame rates while still not looking all that good. And 2 major games, Deus Ex 2 and now Thief 3, have been produced under this horrible thing. Let us pray they don't make any more games using it.


Now, I don't want to totally dissuade people from buying the game. If you have powerful hardware, you can set the resolution to 1024x768 and still get ok frame rates. The game won't look that good, but so it goes. And I have a feeling it's gonna be a very fun game to play, from the little bit I've played so far.

By the way, I have an amd 2800 cpu, geforce fx5900, 512 megs pc 3200 ram, windows xp. At 1024x768, I am getting frame rates of 30-45, generally, in first person mode. Much worse in 3rd person, and much much worse when I tried it briefly at 1280x1024. There is no option to run it at 1280x960, although no one will likely be able to run it above 1024x768 anyway."

[thzone1986]

Damn you Warren Spector! *shakes fist*

How the mighty have fallen. Scant years ago he ranked up there with the likes of Peter Molyneux, Sid Meier, and John Carmack. Now most pc gamers think he's a sell-out.

[soupnazi]

DAMNIT! I hate that Xbox. It has ruined Halo, Deus Ex 2, and now Theif 3. (stupid porting)

[dimmy32]

shitty news - I was going to buy Thief 3, but now I'll download it and try it first before I waste my money. The developers should have known better , after Deus ex2 .

[slates20]

#()$*)@$%(*#$%, after that fiasco with Deus Ex 2, (which I purchased against my better judgement), they do this again? Arrgghh.

[20NemesiS01]

Originally posted by soupnazi
DAMNIT! I hate that Xbox. It has ruined Halo, Deus Ex 2, and now Theif 3. (stupid porting)

Whoa whoa whoa, don't bring the Xbox into this. Hmm, Deus Ex 2 was crap, Thief 3 is crap, they're both done by the same developer... I doubt porting had anything to do with it. And Gearbox did the crappy Halo port, Bungie had nothing to do with that steaming pile.

[Fig]

I don't know about you guys, but Thief I and II both ran like sh!t on my computer...the game WASN'T ABOUT GRAPHICS!!! It was about atmosphere and gameplay.

I swear...seems that people only care about graphics, but b!tch and moan about gameplay.

[Ashpool]

Originally posted by Fig
I don't know about you guys, but Thief I and II both ran like sh!t on my computer...the game WASN'T ABOUT GRAPHICS!!! It was about atmosphere and gameplay.

I was about to say that.

The Thief games were NOTORIOUS for bringing nearly any system to their knees, especially in outdoor environments. The Dark engine, while years ahead of it's time, was poorly coded and wasn't only apparent in Thief (System Shock 2 was just as bad). I know we're talking about a totally different engine here, but it still applies here.

Seriously people, give it a rest already.

[Fig]

It runs smooth as butter on my comp, but I do however only run it at 1024 x 768 as my wonderful 19" died and I'm on a cheapo 17". But...I have all settings on high. I've had no drops in framerate...everything looks great and the shadows are stunning!

Comp specs:
2.4 GHZ P4 @ 2.4GHZ
512mb PC2100
ATI AIW 9700

Still think you guys just like to complain. I do however agree that DeusX 2 blew man sized chunks. So far I'm really diggin Thief 3.

[soupnazi]

So about how many FPS you consider "buttery smooth"? (approximately)

Well, that's good news.

[PointlesS]

Originally posted by Ashpool
The Thief games were NOTORIOUS for bringing nearly any system to their knees, especially in outdoor environments. The Dark engine, while years ahead of it's time, was poorly coded and wasn't only apparent in Thief (System Shock 2 was just as bad). I know we're talking about a totally different engine here, but it still applies here.

that's like the worst excuse ever...if the previous games had bad fps...why should this one? that's like a developer saying "our previous game had poor ai...let's not improve on the sequel...that'll be our trademark!"

though I don't think the engine was really up to it in the first place...it's the same engine that powered unreal 2/ut2k3/4 and it never supported true dynamic lighting in any form...

[dfed]

The simple solution is not to buy Xbox ports for the PC. Spend you cash with developers that make PC games.

Or wait 2 or 3 years and buy them cheep, by which time you'll have upgraded your PC and should have enough power counteract poor optimisations.

I recently got Halo. I don't think my Ti4400 card is upto the job. I'm going to wait a few weeks to see what a X800 card will for the frame rates, before playing any more.

I tried the Deus Ex 2 demo on my PC. What a pile of ****. It's totaly unplayable. They would have made more sales by not releasing the demo. I certainly won't be getting the game.

Maybe I'll get an xbox in 3 or 4 years time when they and their games are dirt cheep.

[Abarine]

Originally posted by Fig
I don't know about you guys, but Thief I and II both ran like sh!t on my computer...the game WASN'T ABOUT GRAPHICS!!! It was about atmosphere and gameplay.

I swear...seems that people only care about graphics, but b!tch and moan about gameplay.

Deus Ex's engine wasn't all that hot, either, but the gameplay WAS good. The problem with DX:IW wasn't only the engine, but the fact that the gameplay was piss-poor. If they have a slow engine, whatever, it'll be fine in two years, I'll play it then. If the gameplay suffered again, though, Mr. Spector will have succesfully ruined two of the best franchises out there.

I almost don't want to see a System Shock 3 if this trend continues.

[PointlesS]

actually because of the engine there was never any open area spots like the previous game which totally ruined it for me...everything was so cramped it made the sniper rifle feel like a bolt action pistol with a scope...

[Kamakazie]

You sir, are on crack. Deus Ex 2 was completely unplayable on my system due to horrible framerates, Thief 3 on the other hand, runs decently.