I might actually do this!

[Smythe]

So so much misinformation and lack of knowledge.

One, the problem with the Foxconn sockets isn't a problem for 99.9% of users. Unless you're doing competitive overclocking/benchmarking with a phase, dry ice, or LN2/LH4 (I've never seen liquid helium used with intel chips, cold bug) you don't have to worry. The reduced contact on the power delivery pins only becomes a problem when the CPU is sucking down over 150W of power. That simply is not going to happen with water or air cooling.

Two, the LGA1156 chips are not particularly anymore difficult to overclock than the LGA1366 chips. Getting to 4.0GHz with either the Lynnfield or Bloomfield platform is not that difficult. The Lynnfield chips generally will need a bit more vcore to reach the 4.2-4.3GHz range on account of the on-die PCIe controller, but not much more. Furthermore, their much lower TDP than the Bloomfield chips will offset this. Heat output will be more or less the same for both chips at similar clockspeeds.

Three. There seems to be this misconception that any LGA1156 processor does not support simultaneous multithreading. The Core i5 does not support SMT, however the Lynnfield-based Core i7 processors do support two threads per core just like their Bloomfield counterparts.

Unless you need gobs of PCIe lanes (triple SLI or SLI and a RAID HBA) you're better off getting a Lynnfield system. It'll save you about $100-$200 that you can spend on something else, maybe get an SSD. Finally, I think that AMD is pretty much irrelevant at this point. The consumer Nehalem variants have pushed AMD out of the mid-range and relegated them to the very low-end of the market.

Since the majority of this post was directed at me I thought I'd respond.

One, would you please tell me how it's OK for there to be improper electrical contact unless using sub-zero cooling and going for extreme overclocks? There has been a report of burnt pins with someone who didn't even overclock (http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/sh....php?t=2540820). Maybe there's something else at work here, but to basically say that it's impossible to burn a CPU unless under extreme cooling is just as misleading as anything I've said. I doubt that's what you're saying, but that's the way it's coming off. I'd also like to see where this 150W number came from. I've been following the XtremeSystems thread that first brought to light the issue of melting sockets, the Anandtech article that exposed the problem and the discussion on [H] and the closest thing I've ever seen to a number regarding power is this comment by the author of the Anandtech article:

Physically it's really hard to tell. Foxconn say their revision is in the top plate, but I have not seen anything other than the one I have on my boards here. Further a report from DFI revealed the user issue I reported above from mainland China (that was single thread 32m at 4.7Ghz though).

If I get any more info on this I'll update.

BTW 32m single thread at 5Ghz only darwas about 60w to VCC. So it is a little scary.

later
Raja

Is the VCC wattage simply added to the 95W TDP which would give 155W total?

Two, sorry if it came across as if I was saying the 1156 is extremely difficult to overclock. However, you do say that the on-die PCIe controller does make things slightly harder which is all I was saying. For those that don't mind playing with voltages there's no problem, but I'm chicken **** when it comes to voltages. My first major foray into overclocking was with the P4 Northwood that had the Sudden Northwood Death Syndrome and the Gradual Northwood Death Syndrome. I didn't put much voltage into mine (under the "limit" thought to cause SNDS), but after awhile I had to back down on my overclock significantly because it was no longer stable, an overclock that was initially Prime stable for 48 hours. It's also been my experience that adding voltage doesn't get me much more from an overclock, if any at all, no matter which voltages I adjsut.

The only "facts" I presented are that there is a contact issue with p55 motherboards using Foxconn sockets and that the on-die PCIe controller makes overclocking more difficult. Everything else I said about those issues was simply my opinion and guesses on what could potentially happen. I'm sorry if it came across as if I were stating my opinions as fact. I still wouldn't get an 1156 chip despite these potential issues, but that is my personal opinion which I hope I'm still entitled to. It's ultimately up to [DWC]Darkwolf to make the decision for himself.

With all that said with the findings here by Lathode about the pin holes being there direct from Intel, of which I can confirm is the case by looking at the never-before-installed i5 I have here, does make me question somewhat the conclusions Raja has come to when he said this. However, no one has disproved that there is a contact issue and with supposed admittance by Foxconn that there was a problem and for DFI, EVGA and MSI to stop using Foxconn sockets shows that caution for now is advised. Maybe the problem isn't with the Foxconn socket, but all the information we have says that it is. I do not feel I'm guilty of giving false information, but that's really only because I'm going on the conclusions of others and cannot personally verify any of the claims. I trust that those who are looking into the issue know something of what they're talking about, but if it comes out that there is no problem with the Foxconn socket I will admit that I was unknowingly spreading false information and for that I would be sorry.

[Nater]

No, I don't think there is any real benefit to going with an i7 over an i5 in your case. With the levels of overclocking you're looking for, multipliers aren't going to be an issue.

I don't think that the pin seating issues will cause problems to mildly overclocked systems in the long term, but you never know. If you're worried, the best place to get Tyco sockets seems to be EVGA at this point. Their high-end boards only use Tyco AMP and it's a 50/50 shot with the lower-end boards. You could always return and take the restock fee if you're really worried about it.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Yah, I'll be waiting at least a few more days I think. I'm not willing to shell out for a high end mobo, as that sort of defeats the point of 1156 in my eyes.. The entry level full ATX EVGA board looks pretty nice though. Newegg has a rebait on it, which makes it sort of the same price as the ASUS I was looking at before the whole socket thing came up. I'll first try to contact Newegg and see if they can varify the make of socket I'll actually recieve. If not, I'll see if my local comp usa has it in stock and will let me open it up. (Or better yet, open it up wihtout having me drive all the way down first!) I think they even price match, I'm not sure.

[Nater]

Just look at how smoked the sockets are, it's pretty obvious that the damage didn't occur on some single threaded SuperPi pull. The 150w-160w number came from Anandtech. I've never, owned, much less overclocked one of these chips to this level so I've never had an ammeter on the EPS12v line. But 150-175W for a chip like this at 5GHz+ with 4 cores (8 threads?) loaded seems about right.

Just because something can be damaged at high levels of abuse does not mean that it can be damaged by long duration low-levels of abuse. Only time will tell on that one and I've yet to see anything that says this will occur.

Anyway, I wish someone here had one overclocked to this level and had pics of the amperage being sucked down by the EPS12v line so we could get a good idea of how much wattage they draw at certain levels of load. I could go to XS and look for it, but I don't feel like digging through a lot of different threads with hundreds of posts.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Ok, I think I'll go ahead and order stuff fairly soon. I'd thought hard about getting the i7, sorta "just because." But that's stupid. I'll get the basic EVGA P55 mobo. I like the look, it may come with a Lotes socket, and it has mounting points for an LGA 775 cooler, which seems pretty key. If anyone knows a good 1156 cooler, let me know, but there arne't many options. For LGA 775, the Thermalright Ultra-120 looks pretty good for $50.

I'm still not sure exactly which RAM to sring for. DDR 1600 seems like agood speed for the money, but I'm not sure what I'll actually need.. For $81 there's G.Skill RipJaws with 8-8-8-24. For $100 and no free shipping, I could have Mushkin Enhanced Blackline with 7-7-7-20. I still want 8 gigs weather it's overkill or not. Right now, I'm feeling the squeeze with 2 gigs, and the switch to a 64-bit OS will increase requirements further. I'd just assume buy more now and not have to track down something "close enough" later to match up what I already have. DDR 1333 doesn't seem to have anything with lower timings for less money.. If I go all the way down to 1066, Corsair XMS2 has 5-6-6-18 for $60 after rebaits. There's also PNY with 5-5-5-15 for $85. Correct me if I'm wrong though, if I have a higher rated memory like 1600, and end up running it slower, aren't I likey to be able to run it on faster timings anyway?

Update: Eh, I think I'll go with the Cooler Master V8. It looks pretty good, and it's got over 500 reviews on newegg with very high ratings. Since it comes with a fan (thought I had a 120 kikcing aorund, but can't find it..) and has free shipping, it's cheaper than the Thermalright from somewhere else.

On a side note, I still have a tube of Arctic Silver 5 from the last build. That was a few years ago now, is there any reason not to use it? I guess the V8 comes with something, but I don't know what.

[fluffmonster]

AS5 will separate so I probably wouldn't use a tube that had been sitting idle for a couple years. Theoretically though, you can mix it back up and it would be just fine.

Yes, the ram will run at tighter timings if its at less than rated speed. I have C9 1333 which is actually running at C8 because its running at 1066. Overall though, don't sweat it so much, it doesn't matter that much.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Yeah ok. I'll use whatever the HSF comes with.. And I won't sweat the ram. 1600 is obviously where it's at, and it's not worth $40 for one step better timing.

[Smythe]

5) Storage of Arctic Silver 5

To keep Arctic Silver 5 fresh for future applications, always replace the cap on the syringe after each use. The syringe should be stored tip down so that any seperation between the particles and suspension fluid will be at the back end of the syringe. Like any mix of particles that are many times heavier than the suspension fluid, there will be some seperation in the compound over time when stored in the original syringe. Because all thermal compounds eventually experience seperation in storage, storing in a cool place like a refrigerator will also lessen the seperation over time. However, this does not affect the performance of the un-seperated or remixed compound.

Your AS5 should be fine. It may be runny at first, but the TIM should still be good. Until you're ready to use it you could tape it, with the cap straight down, to your fridge. I still have some AS3 and have yet to have any issues.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Ok, I ordered my stuff! I went with the EVGA mobo, the i750, 8 gigs of G.Skill 1600 8-8-8-24, a Cooler Master V8 HSF, and a 200mm case fan to hack into the side pannel. I also went ahead and got a fresh tube of AS5. They had a combo for it wiht a DVI cable I wanted anyway for a second screen. If I can get a $20 rebait squared away on whichever item it came with, it'll be just under $600 for everything.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Well that was friggin' fast. I already have all my stuff. I got a Foxconn socket. =/ Whatever. Seems like I should install the cpu once and pull it out and try to see if contact was made on all pins? Or stick it in once and leave well enough alone?

[anubis44]

Generally, I would insert/remove a CPU as seldom as possible for precisely the reason that you're stressing the various moving parts/flexing the board a bit/removing and replacing the HSF and having to make sure it's properly seated and that the thermal paste is adequately applied, etc. If you know what you're doing, and you tear apart computers regularly, you're probably fine. I mess around with my computers all the time and rarely have a problem. If you're not so confident about building computers, then I'd leave well enough alone once you get the CPU installed and properly seated. Just my 2 cents worth.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Properly seated is the million dollar question with the Foxconn socket though. Well, I've put together a few computers in my time, but not to recently. I'm comfortable with the hardware for my own part though.. On the other hand, I don't think I have it in me to properly examine 1156 tiny pads. One doesn't realise how small they really are untill the CPU is in your hand. I even lost track of it for a few minutes when I was snapping some shots of the two coolers for my friend. That had me worried!

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Well this is awesome. The LGA 775 clips for my Cooler Master V8 are assembled upside down. So I would be hand torquing the thing to the CPU, if the bolts even reach through the backing plate.. And the tension springs would be left dangling in the air..

Eh. I uppose this isn't the end of the world. I'll have to snip open the ends of the clips so I can free the pins and put them back the right way.. Also, the 775 implementation by EVGA seems like a slight hack job, as the holes are rotated. It's not really their fault, just what's necessary to have both. The end resault is that the HSF will be rotated on the mobo and look strange. The backing plate is VERY close to the backing of the socket itself. Enough that I'm slightly concerned.

Ha! Ok, well, the adjustable clips I'm dealing with also fit the 1156 holes. So, in theory, this thing is OK for pretty much any socket there is. I noticed that what I was dealing wiht is the same kit they show on their website for 1156... And in that picture, their's is also configured the same way.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

All right! I'm setup on the new system!

A few problems I ran into:

First of all, and this is pretty amusing, I was so caught up with all the new stuff and worrying about the 1156 failures and trying to find the rihgt cooling solution and so on... Well a *minor* oversight on my part; the EVGA mobo has no IDE! So I'm down one hard drive there, and my optical drive too.

Second, the first x16 slot being higher on this board than the old one and blocks the lowest HDD slot. Also, the Cooler Master V8 so large that blocks the upper slot. So in the 3 drive holder of my Antec mid tower, I can use only yhe center slot. I still have two slots where a floppy might have gone if I owned one.. But I did have 5 drives installed before, so all told, I'm out two hard drives and my CDRom. At least the internet works.

I wanted to hop right into some Fallout 3. With the Fallout Mod Manager, I've never needed the DVD in the drive. But now it seems I do. Strange.

[[DWC]DarkWolf]

Well it's already been a little while. I'm just sitting at a base clock of 3.2ghz right now, turbo causes it to run just under 3.4 normaly, and it *can* peak at around 3.8ghz with one core, but seems to sort of bounce back and fourth from 3.4 to 3.6 to 3.8. That's prime95 though, so a less intenssive single threaded app might stay higher. I don't know. It probably wouldn't need to, so who cares? At any rate, the idea that turbo would kick it up to 3.8 or close to 4.0 is purely theoretical, if not just plain wrong. That said, Dragon Age Origins has yet to drop below 30fps at max settings at 1080p, and often just stays locked at 60. I'm happy. Other games seem to play a lot better too that I had no idea just how CPU bound I really was. For example, Need For Speed Undercover never seemed to drop to a low frame rate, but it did sort of buck and surge. I thought it was due to whatever BS they have in the physics engine due to the absurd speads. I was wrong, it's very smooth and consistent now. Fallout 3 is a lot better, but I knew it would be. The final push to the end isn't a slide show, which is fantastic! It slows down if everything explodes in my face, but whatever.

I don't see a need to push higher overclocks any time soon. Some day, and probably with a different video card, I will. And I haven't even installed 64-bit windows yet! You guys might be right about more than 4 gigs is overkill, but I still don't care.