Which part(s) do you think are dead/dying? And suggestions for new parts.

[CrimsonShroud]

I built a new system about 15 months ago, and it just died on me a few days ago. There were no warning signs. Everything was working great, with no silly errors or anything and then, out of nowhere, my screen just goes pure black. No error messages, just a black void. I try to reboot and it's the same thing, just black, with the monitor reporting no input. There were also no beeps upon start up.

I opened up the machine and found a lot of dust in the processor fan and elsewhere. Unfortunately this wasn't regular dust but was the residue of some tile work that had been done several days prior, which includes (I am guessing) the little bits of grout they tore up from the old floor and the tile dust from having cut the new tiles. I know it wasn't a smart thing to leave the computer close to where they were working, but I've been dealing with an illness and I didn't even think to cover or move the computer to somewhere safe, as my mind has been more on my health.

So, after seeing this, I pretty much figured that my PSU, processor, and/or motherboard had died or were failing, due to this heavy dust they sucked in. Normally I would have checked here first, and tried to figure things out for myself, but I didn't really feel like it, as I've been feeling not so good for the last few weeks. Besides, I didn't have to spare parts lying around to definitively deduce which parts had gone bad.

I decided to just save myself some trouble and take it into a shop. I asked the guy to specifically test the PSU, processor, and motherboard. I had to wait a few days before he called me. He said the motherboard had died and that he thought my PSU was failing. He seemed to think the processor was fine, and that I just needed a new motherboard and possibly a new PSU in the future. He had a motherboard in the store he said he could sell me. Thankfully, I asked him the model number of the board before he hung up so that I could check it out online first. It was a good board. The problem was that it was a board for athlon 64s and semprons, and my processor is a quadcore phenom.

I had already been disappointed that he wasn't able to definitively tell me whether my processor and PSU needed to be replaced or not, but now he was trying to sell me a board I couldn't even use (I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he just missed something, and that it wasn't intentional). This now made me question whether or not the motherboard was even the problem now too. I also hadn't felt good about him suggesting I could continue to use my PSU when he suspected it was dying. Everything I remember having read says you don't want to screw around by keeping a failing PSU attached to your system.

Anyway, I was pretty frustrated, so I called another store to see what they would charge to give me another diagnosis before picking up my computer from the first guy. Their price was fair but, after having picked up my computer and paying one fee already and still being left in the dark about what the problem was, I was reluctant to pay any more, waste more time, and possibly not get any new information.

I decided against it, and have resolved to just deal with the problem(s) myself. So anyway, what do you guys think needs replacing? If it matters, my system is as follows:

-Antec NeoPower 650 650W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready Modular Active PFC Power Supply
-ECS NFORCE9M-A(1.0) AM2+/AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 8100 ATX AMD Motherboard (not a great board, I know)
-AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz 4 x 512KB L2 Cache 2MB L3 Cache Socket AM2+ 95W Quad-Core Processor
-SAPPHIRE 100245L Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card
-G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory

Currently I am leaning towards just buying a new motherboard, processor, and power supply, since I am not sure which of them may be dead or damaged, just to be safe and to avoid any more headaches (and to get my main system back up and running sooner rather than later). But if you guys think all of the tile dust sucking the processor and PSU did didn't ruin them, then I'll stick with what I have and replace whatever you think is broken for cheaper.

If you can't determine what is broken for sure, I am open to suggestions what new motherboard, CPU, and PSU to buy. I would probably buy a new hard drive to go with them as well. At a first glance I was thinking of going with the following new parts:

-KINGWIN ABT-730MM 730W ATX 12V Ver.2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready Active PFC Power Supply
-GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H AM3 AMD 785G HDMI Micro ATX AMD Motherboard
-AMD Athlon II X4 620 Propus 2.6GHz 4 x 512KB L2 Cache Socket AM3 95W Quad-Core Processor
-Western Digital Caviar Blue WD6400AAKS 640GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive

Power supplies are one of the things I don't know as much about as I should, so I'm not sure if the one I listed is my best choice. The rest of the parts look pretty good to me, and I'll just recycle the memory and video card I listed earlier. But, as I said, I'm open to suggestions if anyone has anything better in mind for a comparable price. I'm looking to keep it at around $350 or less total.

Thanks.

[RealBeast]

If it's only 15 months old, then some will still be under warranty. The PSU warranty is 5 years. RMA that first.

If you get nothing on turning on the computer, the PSU is your most likely problem. Everything else could be fine.

[PriMaTe]

My guess is PSU or mobo. Something like that happened to me, system died and would not power up, thought it was psu, turned out to be the mobo.

Just buy a psu from the store and try it, if it boots you know it's the psu, if it doesn't then it's the mobo. That way you get instant feedback and then you can return the psu

[CrimsonShroud]

Thanks for the responses guys. I never RMAed anything before but, after having read Antec's warranty information, I don't think I would qualify, given that it was my own fault for leaving it exposed to all of the tile dust. I just remembered that I do have an old 400w Antec PSU in my closet. I guess if I took my video card out I would be able to power on safely and be able to see if the current PSU is the problem. Not sure if I was clear in my first post, but the system does seem to power up (noise wise, fans are running) just nothing happens and it goes to a blank black screen. I didn't try to re-start it more than once though for fear of frying other parts if the PSU was indeed bad. I heard a grinding noise and got alarmed but, afterwards, I realized that was probably a loose case fan cord that came undone and brushed against the CPU fan. One thing that was weird was that when I hit the open on my optical drives, they immediately opened then automatically closed. I'm not sure if that means anything though.

About the CPU, do you think there is any chance that the tile dust settling into the fan could have broke it? I've never had a problem with a CPU before, so I don't know what causes them to break, other than overheating (which could have been the case here, although I thought my system was set to power down if the temp got too high). I'll go switch out PSUs now and see if that sheds any light on the situation then come back and give an update.

Edit: Doh. I found the other PSU, but it's a little too old, as it only has a 20 pin main power cable. It could just be that the motherboard is bad and the whole timing of the tile dust is just a coincidence, making me paranoid that the problem is more severe than it really is. I'm leaning towards just buying a new board in the morning since that is what the guy told me was wrong, even though I didn't exactly have 100% confidence in his diagnosis for the reasons mentioned above.

[Learux]

PSU is easy to check, take it into bestbuy, the geeks will test it for free. If the PSU passes the test my guess will be the motherboard.

Depending on what tiles you are using the filings might be conductive and shortend out the mobo.

CPU fail is highly unlikely and would be the last part to be considered.

[CrimsonShroud]

Thanks Learux. I hadn't even considered the fact that the tile bits might have shorted the motherboard. It was porcelain tile, and I just read that porcelain isn't a good conductor and is a good insulator. Of course, who knows what else is mixed into the tiles? A short of the motherboard does seem a bit more likely given it just happened suddenly, without any warning. I would think if it were the PSU some warning signs would have been present before a complete death occurred.

Even if I can assume the broken piece is the motherboard, I am still left with some concern in replacing it and leaving the PSU and CPU, not knowing if they have sucked up some small pieces of the tiles which may fall out and short the new board as well. If the tile was the cause of the short then I would really have to carefully clean the entire case and each component as thoroughly as possible, or else I would be risking having the same problem occur again.

[CrimsonShroud]

Hmmm, ok a bit of an update here. When the computer first died, I tried to restart and nothing. Then I opened the case up, saw all of the dust and blew and shook out as much as possible. I then tried to restart and there was the same blank black screen, but now there was a grinding/pulsating noise coming from the computer. I got nervous and just powered down and decided I would take it in and let a professional handle things. I later thought that after I had shaken the computer, a case fan cord had just come loose and and brushed against the CPU fan to make the noise (this had happened before).

So anyway, today I decided to try to power up again (making sure the case fan cords were not in the way of the CPU fan), and the same noise was there. It sounds like the power is pulsating, like it has enough power, then doesn't and causes something in the computer to grind a little (maybe my video card). I unplugged the PSU from the video card and tried to power up again. There was still the blank black screen with the monitor reporting no input, but now the unnatural sound was gone. Everything sounded smooth as it should.

So what do you think the problem is? I am guessing the PSU is dying and is providing less power, so that the video card cannot function properly. I am hesitant to hook up the PSU to the video card again, fearing that it could damage or kill it. Do you think the video card could be damaged already? Even without a video card the system should still post though right?

So it sounds like the mobo is dead, the PSU is failing, and the video card might be at risk too? I'll also mention that the CPU fan, case fans, and lights on the video card come on, in case that matters.

I really don't want to have to take the computer into another shop again, but I am now becoming confused on what caused my computer to fail in the first place.

Again, there were no warning signs at all before the system just died. Since the PSU seems to be losing power, could it have been the component that failed initially?

So how is this for a theory of what happened?:

The PSU sucks in some bad tile dust, starts losing power, this somehow shorts the motherboard and perhaps causes the video card to die as well?

Or could the motherboard being dead somehow prevent the video card from powering on as it should?

What doesn't make any sense is that both the PSU and motherboard would fail at the same time without one (the PSU) causing the other (motherboard) to fail. But I just don't know for sure.

Is there anyone who can help me in figuring out what has happened with my system? I'm starting to go a little stir crazy trying to pinpoint the problem(s). I just wish I knew what to replace so I could get the system back up and running without any further delays.

[PriMaTe]

The only things that make noise in a computer are the mechanical parts in the computer, which are the fans and the harddrive. So if you hear "grinding" coming from the video card it's because the fan is making noise. Clean out all of the dust and try a new psu with the system, the only way to pinpoint these things is by trial & error. You're overanalyzing the situation

[CrimsonShroud]

I think you're right about me over-analyzing things. I just tested the processor by taking off its fan, putting my finger on it, powering on for a few seconds, then quickly powering the system off. The processor seemed to warm up during those few seconds, so it should be OK. I am convinced the mobo is dead and that the PSU is screwed up. I'm just going to order a new mobo and PSU and hope that fixes things. I'll report back either way once I've hooked up the new parts. With any luck it'll fire up fine and I won't have to replace anything else.

[CrimsonShroud]

Well the parts I ordered last week (mobo, psu) finally came in yesterday, but I still can't post. The motherboard gives continuous long beeps (like a beep for 2 seconds, silence for 4-5 seconds, then the long beep again, then the silence, over and over). The mobo manual says this error means the video card isn't seated properly, but it looks seated correctly to me. I even reinserted it to be sure. I also used the eraser trick on both the memory and the video card's gold contacts to see if that would help, but it didn't. I tried switching the memory around too and just using one stick or the other but, again, the same error.

The video card fan spins normally, and there is a red light which flashes on it several times when the motherboard is not beeping (never when it is beeping). Any clues as to what the problem is? The motherboard isn't aligned 100% perfectly in the case (but very close). I could go back and try to align it perfectly but, honestly, I don't think it could be the problem. The video card still looks seated just fine as is.

The system is now:

-GIGABYTE GA-MA770-UD3 AM2+/AM2 AMD 770 ATX AMD Motherboard
-CORSAIR CMPSU-650TX 650W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply
-AMD Phenom 9600 Agena 2.3GHz 4 x 512KB L2 Cache 2MB L3 Cache Socket AM2+ 95W Quad-Core Processor
-SAPPHIRE 100245L Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card
-G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory

Unfortunately, I don't have a spare video card lying around to troubleshoot things. The mobo has no onboard video either. From what I've read elsewhere, this board has some problems with certain memory, but I also read 1 or 2 accounts saying the pci-e slot has come broken. And then my video card could just be damaged from when the original motherboard died. Again, I don't have the spare parts to troubleshoot things, so I'll be taking it in to another shop tomorrow, unless you guys think you know what the problem is.

[RealBeast]

Silly question, but is the CPU atx12 and video card power connector firmly attached? It's a corollary to RB's theorum: when all else fails check the connections.

[Learux]

Check a different videocard, where is this red light you are talking about?

[Spank_Me_Hard]

Question:

Do you have a GOOD surge protector?

I'm wondering if maybe you got a good power spike that damaged multiple parts?

Narrowing down the issue can be much more difficult when you have multiple parts go bad at once. Which is a possibility that I'd seriously be considering given the experience thus far.