The Official NFL Thread

[md1198p]

One is acceptable behaviour, the other two are not.

Disrespectful to the other players and in fact to the integrity of the game.



I agree. And different players will also celebrate differently. A spiking of the ball is pretty typical, but there are literally a zillion and one ways to celebrate scoring a TD that don't degrade the game or other players. Had Jackson pulled a TO and done something new like TO did when he pulled out the sharpie I could have cared less.

But he didn't. He actually taunted before the TD was scored (and hence, as you say... no penalty). This behaviour, and similar the he's done in the past indicates that he doesn't respect other players or the game itself. Hence, he's a primate.



Hmm. Do tell.

Maybe your so used to it in basketball that you don't care if it enters football as well. If so, I think that many football purists would disagree. Again, I don't want to see football "ghetto-ized" as basketball has become.



Thought about it, but decided not. But since you've gone through the lengths to call me out on it, let me clear it up for you:

Totally agree.

As the rules are written, you are absolutely correct.

Didn't think that I needed to comment really but there it is for you. Happy?

I will say this though: If pre-TD taunting start becoming common (or even just from a single isolated incident like this), I can see the team owners getting together to stop this. Have the officials start penalizing pre-TD taunting to clean up the game. In fact, my money is on that it will happen at some point. Probably sooner than later.

They have a valuable product that they don't want to see cheapened and tarnished.

[Spank_Me_Hard]

LOL!

That's all you got? More ghetto lower primate?

If this keeps up, Jackson will become too cancerous for the Eagles and Reid before too long.

[Snakespy]

I don't see why that's "ghetto." Would you still be saying that if he was white? And lol at the primate thing.

Anyways who looks like the superbowl contenders so far? I kind of would like to see the Falcons go at this point. Or the Saints again.

[md1198p]

I don't see why that's "ghetto." Would you still be saying that if he was white? And lol at the primate thing.

Anyways who looks like the superbowl contenders so far? I kind of would like to see the Falcons go at this point. Or the Saints again.

In the NFC the Saints scare me the most. They just have Philly's number.

Atlanta is the opposite. We always seem to beat them, and pretty bad. We destroyed them earlier, and that was without Vick and missing 3 field goals. Reid gameplans them well, they never seem to know what we are doing on offense and we make them look real bad. I know they are really good at home, but I like our team speed on the turf and in the dome. Lastly, their biggest weakness is secondary, and thats a bad matchup against our receivers.

After the Saints, I would say the Bears would be the second toughest team for us. I know they beat us, but Cutler played almost perfect in that game and I am not sure he could go 2 games against us without turning the ball over. Philly on defense reminds me a little of the Saints last year, they don't shut anyone down, but get lots of turnovers and sacks, and seem to come up with stops in key situations. Its a dangerous way to play, but with a offense thats scores like we do it can work, giving them extra possessions is suicide.

[md1198p]

LOL!

That's all you got? More ghetto lower primate?

If this keeps up, Jackson will become too cancerous for the Eagles and Reid before too long.

Nope. Luckily, with a guy like Jackson, I could probably do this all day.

[md1198p]

I don't see why that's "ghetto." Would you still be saying that if he was white? And lol at the primate thing.

Anyways who looks like the superbowl contenders so far? I kind of would like to see the Falcons go at this point. Or the Saints again.

I don't get it either. How ghetto becomes synomomous with being cocky and showboating is a very strange use of the term.

[md1198p]

After watching one of Deseans celebrations in slow motion, I now agree with you Spank. It definetly was was over the top and excessive. This is what I saw when I broke the tape down.

[r'aggro]

Ahaha! I kinda like the Eagles, I'll pull for them in the post season.

[Spank_Me_Hard]

I don't see why that's "ghetto." Would you still be saying that if he was white? And lol at the primate thing.

Yes. Yes I would.

Don't make it a race thing.

I call athletes "monkey" all the time. Including hockey players on my team, the Oilers. Who don't have one black guy.

e.g. Shaun Horcoft is playing likle a monkey.

I say it ALL the time. And I don't check to see what colour a guy is before saying it. "Primate" either.

I don't get it either. How ghetto becomes synomomous with being cocky and showboating is a very strange use of the term.

Really.

Maybe because ghetto people don't know how to carry themselves in a respectful manner?

Seems pretty simple to me.

There's a fine line between cocky and being a primate. Sounds like you're unsure where it's at. Which, given your defense of basketball and being ignorant of it being ghetto-ized doesn't really surprise me.

After watching one of Deseans celebrations in slow motion, I now agree with you Spank. It definetly was was over the top and excessive. This is what I saw when I broke the tape down.

LOL!

Awesome.

Glad to see that you came over to the side of common horse sense.

[MrDigital]

It won't be long before someone busts him up for being a douche, so it doesn't matter. No point in 4 pages of arguing.

[md1198p]

Was Larry Bird ghetto?

[MrDigital]

Was Larry Bird ghetto?

The NBA wasn't ghetto in the 80s and early 90s. It wasn't until the mid 90s that the whole thing went downhill. It became the gangsta rap of professional sports.

[md1198p]

The NBA wasn't ghetto in the 80s and early 90s. It wasn't until the mid 90s that the whole thing went downhill. It became the gangsta rap of professional sports.

Some examples? Trash talking has been part of basketball for as long as I can remember. Thats includes 80's and 90's. Larry Bird was one of the biggest trash talkers of all time, as where players like Barkley, Jordan, Miller, and Magic Johnson.

[Spank_Me_Hard]

I'm not that much of a fan of basketball, but I do follow it minimally (my roomie is a huge Lakers fan and I'll sit in and watch a bit). And while I'm not a regular watcher, I can't help but know a little about it as it's such a highly visible sport. In short, I'm not completely ignorant about it.

The NBA has been wrestling with "image" issues for a while now. The fact that they're now cracking down on new things this year validates that.

Here's a good article from a few years ago on the "brand image" issue:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...111802752.html

NBA Fights to Regain Image
One Year Later, Brawl Leaves a Mark Throughout League

Indiana Pacers' Ron Artest received a 73-game suspension and lost nearly $5 million in salary for his role in a brawl with fans in Detroit one year ago. (AP)

One headline read: "National Brawlers Association." An editorial in a major newspaper described the NBA as being "long known as a halfway house for pampered, self-indulgent millionaire athletes with minimally controlled tempers." Conservative talk-show pundit Rush Limbaugh described the incident as "gang behavior on parade minus the guns. That's the culture that the NBA has become." Syndicated columnist Clarence Page said, "the jaw-dropping footage has aired over and over again like an ad for some sort of a 'Negroes Gone Wild' video."

"It became a convenient outlet for people saying, 'those thugs' and 'those punks.' And that's hurtful to NBA players and undeserved," NBA Commissioner David Stern said in an interview this week, when discussing the initial reaction following what is considered the ugliest clash between athletes and fans in the nation's history.

One year ago today, a beer-filled cup landed on the chest of Indiana Pacers forward Ron Artest as he lay on the scorer's table and triggered an unsightly melee between several members of the Pacers and fans of the Detroit Pistons at the Palace of Auburn Hills in Michigan.

The league is still trying to recover.

In the aftermath, players and fans were subjected to lawsuits and criminal charges, some of which are still pending. Stern handed out stiff penalties two days afterward, suspending nine players, including a record 73-game suspension for Artest, who lost almost $5 million in salary.

"A lot of people felt I overreacted," Stern said. "We had to establish the barrier that vigilante actions that involve players and fans are not acceptable. We cannot tolerate that. It was one event that didn't help anything."

Realizing that his league had a serious image problem -- which was magnified by sagging ratings and merchandise sales -- Stern has made several "small steps" to help the NBA rebound. The league has established a fan code of conduct (which includes, among other things, prohibiting sale of alcoholic beverages in the fourth quarter), a dress code (which requires players to wear "business casual" clothing) and a community outreach program called "NBA Cares" (which plans to raise and contribute $100 million for charity). "By and large, I'm very satisfied with where we are right now," Stern said.

Kathleen Hessert, president and chief executive officer of Sports Media Challenge, a Charlotte-based public relations and crisis management firm, applauded Stern for his swift, uncompromising actions on the suspensions and said the league's image is on the upswing.

"The NBA, I think recognizes its relevance and the importance of its brand, and image is part of that brand. The response showed that it understood the negative image. Everything from the dress code to media training, is saying, 'We need to re-look at our brand and what we're saying to the world, how we're saying it and if it reflects what we want it to,' " said Hessert, who is aiding such teams as the Orlando Magic and Charlotte Bobcats with media training.

Pacer Jermaine O'Neal, one of the participants in the brawl, said players and fans were taught a valuable lesson. "I think one good thing that everybody learned from the Detroit situation was that, you can have fun -- you can heckle -- but you got to know how to turn it off when it gets serious because we are talking about basketball," said O'Neal, who was suspended 25 games but served only 15 for punching a fan who walked onto the court and was one of five Pacers sentenced to one year of probation. "Basketball is strictly entertainment. We go home, see our families and friends and we live regular lives. We come here, entertain fans for 48 minutes and when it's over, it's a wrap."

Stern said he never thought about eliminating the intimacy of the NBA. In fact, despite stricter security measures, some arenas, such as Atlanta and Miami, have offered fans closer seats than ever before. "After the incident, you pretty much thought that it was going to be like playing overseas, with a barbed wire separating you from the fans," Washington Wizards forward Antawn Jamison said recently.

"We certainly focused on post-Detroit as a low point as far as perception of our league because the media ran with . . . the notion that this was representative of the NBA," Stern said. "Being that I've been commissioner for 27,000 games and it happened once, I don't know what representative means."

Asked why isolated incidents such as the brawl led to a condemnation of the entire league, Stern paused. "Do you really want to go there? Do I have to?" Stern asked. "I think it's fair to say that the NBA was the first sport that was widely viewed as a black sport. And whatever the numbers ultimately are for the other sports, the NBA will always be treated a certain way because of that. Our players are so visible that if they have Afros or cornrows or tattoos -- white or black -- our consumers pick it up. So, I think there are always some elements of race involved that affect judgments about the NBA."

Seattle SuperSonics guard Ray Allen said the media free-for-all following the brawl was rooted in jealousy. "Whenever you see something going well or doing well, people are envious," Allen said. "The league has been prospering for a couple of decades and a lot of people like taking shots at it."

However, Morris Reid, managing director of the Washington-based branding agency Westin Rinehart Group, said the league's problems run deeper than the brawl one year later.

"I don't know if the league has an image problem, it has a commodity problem. The commodity is not as good as it was in the past," said Reid.

"They thought they were always going to be able to turn to a Michael Jordan or a Larry Bird or a Magic Johnson. I'm not sure LeBron James won't be able to live up to being Michael Jordan, but here's a multibillion dollar sports league that's putting it on the shoulders of these young kids. Is it fair? Sure, because they get these big contracts. Is it bright? Probably not."

Stern envisions a day when the NBA will no longer have an image problem. "All of these things are cyclical. We went through this 25 years ago, when the league was in the process of becoming predominantly African American and people didn't think we'd survive. But here we are, we are surviving and we're thriving and we're doing great."

Granted, the article is five years old but I don't see that the ongoing issues with the NBA's image has really changed that much. It's still addressing it's "brand image" issues. Even talking with many basketball fans this becomes evident.

Stern seemed to understand that the league had an image problem. With the new rule changes that still seem to be ongoing, I'd argue that he still seems to understand it.

This is really no new issue. I'd be surprised if you haven't heard about it before (even if you disagree with it).

[md1198p]

I have a bad feeling Green Bay is going to absolutely destroy the Eagles.